You dead free him right?

You dead free him right?
Immortality is hell.

Immortality is hell.

I wish I was immortal lmao.

Its a really hard decision to side against Maelle after everything.
But this game is a master class of story design so...its supposed to be that way.

i did free him cause i care about both him and Maelle

...Become Piano Man!

MAELLE GET OUT OF THE CANVAS AND GO THE BATHROOM!!!
YOU ARE SHITTING YOURSELF

piano cuck

Painted Verso is a piece of shit and he deserves everything he got and more.

Painted Alicia and Lune suffer way more than this prick

Let Gustave Die

hope he enjoys piano

SING US THE SONG OF THE PIANO MAN
SING US A SONG TONIGHT

You dead free him right?

hi raj!

Fuck Marche. Go back to playing the piano.

How is immortality hell? I'd love to be immortal.

Also your game had a garbage tearjerker story.

I liked him in my first run but he’s honestly a bitch. He spends 70 some years like a nomad in the wilds, yeah maybe that would make you want to kill yourself, but then he meets a bunch of cool people and has a chance to save them all and be a hero and live a good life back in lumiere around people would would enjoy him, and still all he can think about is how much he wants to die, no matter how many people his selfish wants damn.

But I’m doing it for you Alicia, really!

Absolute bullshit. Selfish and self interested to the core. He is not the verso who gave his life to save his sister, he’s a poor copy. Still. Alicia shouldn’t have erased his sister like that, but given how he acted with gustave, he has no right to complain. I still like him as a character but I absolutely do not empathize with his self interest and lies.

No

has no problem killing your father and sister right in front of you

refuses to kill you though despite begging for it

what the HECK was the demiurges problem?

Renoir most certainly intended to kill painted Verso though, he said that to his face

I CAN HEAR YOU SHITTING
PAINT IS COMING OUT OF YOUR GODDAMN ASS

but I absolutely do not empathize with his self interest and lies

Yeah. I also found myself empathazing with Alicia much more. Because at least she has a legit reason to be depressed and miserable. Verso has this weird byronic weltschmertz that kinda makes him come off as a drama queen.

demiurges

Just Alicia. Renoir apologize the hell that Painted Verso went through and was about to give him oblivion until Alicia intervene.

Lune with this hair do things to me...

Verso, I'm not gonna sugarcoat it.

Piano or Stendahl, your pick.

You cannot convince me that Renoir, Painted Verso, Painted Alicia and Gustave couldn't have solved the game's drama and stop Maelle from going mad with grief.
That bastard Verso loves stopping people from fucking talking to each other

Have you watched Lost? That's what the characters are like. Dysfunction for plot's sake

Renoir (the real one) actually had Alicia dead to rights and could've sent her home at any point the story.
He just decided it's going to be funny to use his emotionally compromised, crippled daughter as a child soldier in his crusade against his wife. And then he's surprised she's not being cooperative.

But they couldn't
Alicia was already mad with grief the moment she took over Maelle and had her brother alive right next to her to ease her guilt.

his crusade against his wife

You mean saving his wife's life. I agree that it was wrong of him to bring Alicia into this mess, especially when the only reason she entered the painting was Clea telling her to bring Renoir back to help her fight the writers. But your framing of his motivation is still disingenuous

That would require Renoir talking to his wife and trusting her to paint out her feelings but he went in swinging because he's innately a control freak

trusting her to paint out her feelings

100 years and she was still grieving. She was killing herself and wouldn't stop.
You can force it all you want but Renoir is 100% right in his reaction to Aline.

There is literally a dialogue right after Gustave's death between Aline and Renoir, when she tells him to just send Alicia home, because it's too dangerous for her, and Renoir just goes "nah, it'll be fine". And keep in mind, it's Aline that hates Alicia.
So, he's as much a culprit in all of this as Clea.

Shit writing. he's only lived for 100 years.
That's not enough time to be begging for death unless you wanted to suicide before that anyway.

That's exactly what I said anon. Renoir is in the wrong for bringing Alicia into this mess. Clea is not at fault at all, she wanted Alicia to bring Renoir *out* of the painting. But Renoir's motivations for all of this were still strong and compelling. There's no contradiction here, he can still be in the wrong for that.

It's 100 years knowing you are a fake person and that your family is tearing itself apart because you exist and a painting "you" made.
So his life is just hell.

he just wanted death because… he hecking lived too long!

did you do a speedrun or just play the game through youtube?

Verso was always suicidal, that's why he was so eager to trade his for life Alicia. Renoir likely had suspicions, which is why his Axon is about masks

Clea is not at fault at all, she wanted Alicia to bring Renoir *out* of the painting.

How about you DON'T involve Alicia at all? She's not really in a very sound state of mind after all that happened and Clea only cares about getting Renoir back for her own reasons.

do retarded shit at home (last time you killed your brother)

go to a fake world and stay there

It was a good choice.

I gotta wonder, did anyone else just lose a lot of motivation once the twist was revealed? It just felt that "Okay, so none of these people are actually real, she's basically playing a video game" so obviously we wouldn't want her to stay in the game.
Even Verso is objectively not a real dude, and he knows it.

I go with the assumption that they are very real, otherwise the stakes become an afterthought.
Verso's ending is still the right one of course.

I BEAT SIMON by cheesing him with maelle, it was the only way

He's a liar, a manipulator and a cunt in general.
He fully deserves the piano.

They are sentient living beings, how are they not real? If God exists, are we real?

No, not really. At that point I became super-invested in Alicia and her plight, so I was still motivated.
Although, I really didn't like how the game decided to take sides at the very end instead of making both endings morally grey.

i wanna genocide everyone because I'm just the regular kind of suicidal that comes with having a shitty life.

Tough shit. most anons here a "fake persons" in that they don't matter to anyone and they are not able to be part of normie society without faking it.
Doesn't mean you start thinking it's right to kill everyone.

Filtered.

No. You're the only one.

I beat him with verso gun build and Sciel/Monokko support stun abuse.
I would've loved to try to do him normally but I put all my Lumina into those three and I cba grinding Lumina for hours so my backup team is able to finish him.

Can definitely confirm that, the story loses all stakes in act 3.
I was only able to finish it because of Maelle oneshot ability effectively eliminating combat from the game so it didn't take much time or effort. I've heard they've deleted this ability, and I think the completion rate will drop after that.

but you didn't beat the game

I genuinely fucking wish I didn't beat this game.

Filtered

I was on his side until he revealed that he let Gustave die on purpose.

I got him to Phase 3 without cheese, and then he just sent my main party to the nether and left me with my unprepared sub-party. I cheesed him after that; as far as I'm concerned, he cheesed me first. I was not cheesed to meet him

Just because god is real, it doesn't mean you are suddenly fake. Plus, they have it pretty good in the canvas.

If I found out I'm just a painted version of a dead me and my sister is killing herself so she could spend time with me, I would be in favor of destroying the entire painting too.

Listen Renoircucks, you believe that these Canvas people should get deleted and suffer because he is their god amirite? Well I'm his god, motherfuckers, I make the decision to have his daughter stay in the Canvas to make him suffer for killing the characters I invested so many hours in. How's that, faggota? It's not so funny anymore huh?

If he hadn't done that, we would have unironically gotten a golden ending.
The motivations of most of the cast align with each other, the Lumierians would very much like to live, Painted Verso to die, Renoir to take his family out. Just don't hit Maelle/Alicia with the double cross uppercut of losing her adopted brother and her real brother, and you can all kick Aline out together.

How do you get Alicia out of the painting if she's still Maelle who is strongly attached to the still-alive Gustave?

Maelle got overly attached to Gustave post mortem. Before his death, she loved him clearly, but she left with E33 because she didn't feel like she belonged in Lumiere at all.

Forcibly. Just like painted Renoir did.

Gustave himself would make her leave after learning the truth. Ideally on good terms (ie. come back and visit every once in a while, the same way real Verso and Clea would pop in to play with Esquie).

The moment the Dessendres are out of the painting Renoir goes to Verso's soul and snaps his paintbrush in half. There's no "visiting once in a while"

Gustave wouldn't be able to convince her entirely on his own, but her better state of mind would make her agree to leave. Gustave couldn't even get her to stay in Lumiere. But that same reason is why she would live. With Gustave still alive she would still have that feeling of not belonging instead of being blinded by grief.

Threatens to destroy the canvas to ensure no one can enter it again

Daughter throws a temper tantrum (to the point of defacing public property)

"Alright, I'll let you stay here and slowly kill yourself the same way your mother just tried to"

Renoir's soft. He won't do shit.

I have a feeling Gustave would at least take his time to empathize with her, unlike Verso and Renoir who immediately deem her as unreasonable - even though they are the reasons behind it to begin with.

He lied to her, just like she lied to him. Regardless "I'll leave the lights on for you" doesn't mean he'll keep it permanently, just for however long she still needs to stay, and once she leaves he will destroy the painting.

I mean Maelle would 100% create a painting on her own, that won't be nearly as good as Verso's. So might as well keep this one imo

"Alright, you can bring all these people back to life and play with them for a bit"

"But once you're done I'm going to kill them all"

WTF why won't she leave?

I said he was soft, not an idiot

You just know that if Clea finds out about what happened and finds an opportunity to destroy the canvas, she's going to go in to fuck everything up regardless what renoir/Alicia says, so the parents can go to war for vengeance.She is the cold reasonable one.

turns out real Verso died for nothing to save his sister because she is retarded

Expeditions 32 onward will be yearly excursions to fight off Clea's increasingly powerful abominations. She'd enjoy it

You said he won't do shit, but he will. He conceded to her because he was just defeated by her, Aline's interference probably broke his will to fight and he gave up. So he did what he could to have a final embrace for her, perhaps deluding herself that she really will leave the painting at some point. But it's pretty obvious that if she left the painting, he would still destroy it.

i wish i was immortal

Clea never liked her sister to begin with. Can't even imagine how much she hates Alicia after Verso died for her

cold reasonable one

i'll just send my disabled sister to a perfect wonderland for a few years. hopefully she doesn't get too attached to it like my mother. teehee~

Well, she lied to him, because he absolutely failed to make his point. Renoir's arguments weren't convincing even me, not to mention Alicia herself.
"Alicia, you'll die" and "I want my family back" are not the arguments that will appeal to her, given that she told him at the start that there is not out there for her in the real world. So, she literally doesn't care if she lives or dies in the real world. At that point, Renoir really should've tried to convince her that combing back to the real world has merit for her, but he never did. So, yeah, this conversation wasn't going anywhere to begin with.

t. didn't beat the endless tower

I did, so what?

Then you should have seen that Clea shows her respect and approval of her sister.

Clea never liked her sister to begin with

She loves her family and helps them in the only way possible: being a belligerent cunt holding the whole thing together because the rest of them are sentimental retards

Did you talk to Clea afterwards?

Clea is the one that uses bullying masked as "tough love". She thinks she's fixing things with her no-nonsense attitude, but in reality, she just makes Alicia more resentful.
There is a reason most psychologists consider tough love as a form of abuse.

hates the sister?

Literally the hauler putting the weight of the family on her back.

From her perspective in the real world, Alicia entered the painting, a few moments later Aline was kicked out, then Aline re-entered the painting, then the entire family walked out, then the painting is destroyed.
Cold, reasonable one.

Yea, he should've at least acknowledged her growth as a paintress or maybe went with an angle that Clea could die fighting against the Writers while they're inside the painting.
I don't think Alicia cares that much about Clea but her guilt for killing Verso would probably steer her towards trying to prevent someone else from dying because of her.

Psychologists should try replicating a study for once if they want me to take them seriously

She respected Alicia for managing to beat the endless tower but that's about it. I don't remember her saying anything about forgiving the fact that Verso died for her. In fact she even says that she was closer to him than Alicia/Maelle ever was

If she had to pick which would have died she never would have picked Alicia over Verso

Also there's literally a track called "Clea! Don't Pull Your Sister's Hair!"
Clea played with Verso her whole childhood and created the painting with him. Alicia was too young at that time. There's no way Clea doesn't hate her sister

you've made great strides since i saw you last. don't go backwards

the only thing you owe them is to live a life you enjoy

Why would someone who hates her sister tell her that?

She literally give Alicia a little pep talk about how she should make her own decisions and live her own life, rather than getting embroiled in their parents' spat. You're correct that Clea liked Verso a lot more, but that doesn't mean she hates Alicia.

We don't really have a reference on how the time dilation works between the inside/outside world.
We can assume that it's not as rapid as you make it out, since Alicia at least slept after her parents entered the painting (we also don't know how long they had already been in there).
But assuming that at least 8 hours passed and inside the painting 67 years went by, we can roughly map 1 hour to 8 years. That is if they went into the painting right before Alicia went to sleep.
If we are being more moderate and assume they went inside a couple days ago, then we would be already down to 1 hour = 1 year.
In any case, it wouldn't appear that Alicia jumped in and out since she spent 19 years inside the painting, so even at the fastest that would be at least 2 hours in the real world.
In the worst case weeks or even months could've gone by between her entering and coming out again.

it should be possible to calculate based on Verso's death.

33 December.

maff is too hard, someone do it.

Yeah, I don't think guilt-tripping your depressed daughter that's already been guilt-tripped to hell and back by her mother and sister is going to help much.
He could've at least acknowledged that Alicia was also a victim in this accident and it's not just about Verso, and the family will be there for her when she needs them. Because as we see and read in the journals, everybody was so fixated on Verso, that they forgot about Alicia, who was left to cope with her trauma on her own.
And that's the worst case scenario right there. You have to not deal with the fact that you are now a cripple for life at the age of 16 and your family not only doesn't care, they blame you for it. And you can't even mouth back, because you're a mute.
That's a borderline "I have no mouth and I must scream" moment.

That little pep talk doesn't prove much...
Verso died for Alicia and Clea herself said in the first epilogue that she doesn't know whether she loves or hates him for that.
Remember, Clea wants Maelle OUT of the painting so that Aline loses. Hence why she tries to tell her to leave the painting and "live her own live". Even if Alicia doesn't have much of one outside of it
And Clea's probably right anyway

We can't really calculate it since their fictional calendar has more than 31 days, we know it's at least 33, but it could be more.
Also we don't know at which date they went in/out of the canvas.

The length of a day can also be longer or shorter

I said this already a few days ago, but I wish I had a sibling like Clea. Instead me and my big brother don't talk with each other for 15 years

Yeah. I don't think Clea's going to have enough will and patience to now take care of her disabled sister. She will most likely just shove her aside and tell her to get over it.
Or tell her to take her of herself, because we are only treating you like a child if it's convenient for us.

Your bother has been waiting just as long to hear from you as you have from him

I don't.
In fact I probably would've smothered her with a pillow if she tried to get uppity around me.

Of course I did. Maelle or preferably her mother - who painted the Lumerians in the first place - can just create a new canvas with the same setting without building it on top of Verso's soul being stuck in a personal purgatory...

Hard to explain why but not really because the setting keeps its magical elements even with the reveal, by that I mean that even outside the Canvas, it's not our reality so the "Can we consider the Canvas people real people?" debate is absolutely irrelevant given that the Dessendre also are part of "It's not reality so they are fake people!" conundrum.
In my eyes it's different from, let's say, Star Ocean 3's reveal since its own plot twist has its "fake world" generated by pure hard science from our future or other games where it's just a character from our reality dreaming about shit, here's there's still a layer of separation between the game and "reality".

Verso, both versions, are drama whores making mountains out of inconveniences they could easily handwave and refuse to try any options outside of killing themselves at the first opportunity so what he feels isn't really important to the overall argument.

That's the best way I can explain it because I usually hate the "There's an upper reality!" reveals in games but that one absolutely didn't bother me.

What are the odds of both Versos developing into habitual liars despite growing up in entirely different circumstances? Paìnting and piano were both Alines fortes. I'm beginning to think the reason he "willingly sacrificed" himself for his sister is because it's the one choice his mother would never make.

The game implies real Verso was actually depressed and miserable, but hiding under the mask of a "cool boy".
The Dessandre's were pathological way before his death. But it only resurfaced after his death.

I sure did.
Renoir was right, and he's the only person to cope with Verso's death in the healthiest of ways.

Verso is a character made for endless bullying

There is a reason most psychologists consider tough love as a form of abuse.

Psychologists can't consider a thing if they refuse to study it in order to refute the claim.

It’s not about immortality, just didn’t want to live in the fake world

Maelle made him able to age in her ending. So he will die eventually regardless.
Verso has literally nothing to complain about.

This is Renoir projecting.
Aline is not the one that turned into a mass murderer.

my sister turned into my puppet so I can die while she actively kills herself

All she needs to do is touch grass every now and then, retard. You will die too if you spend 24 hours playing a video game

And she doesn't, which is why Renoir goes in after her, retard.

Being in the painting doesn't automatically mean she'll die either. Clea tells us that both of them have spent a lot longer inside paintings than this one. So all of this conflict is simply because Renoir doesn't trust his wife.

Renoir is just a retarded person who thinks that genociding Hawaii is going to make his wife come back, when the problem isn't Hawaii, the problem is HIM.

Everyone calls her a cripple

Has no movement impairments--just muteness, missing an eye, and facial scarring

Am I missing something? That would still be plenty to get by with, especially in the early 1900s.

As a cripple I don't accept Alicia as one of my people.

Alicia owes it to Verso to live in the real world
She also has to help bring the Writers to justice

She can always git gud and repaint Lumière or at least Esquie and the Gestrals in another Canvas so they exist again somewhere. The fact that you can do this but can't do this with real people proves that real people have priority.

People call her miserable when she's smiling to Clea right before that.

She said that it hurts to even breath.

Being in the painting too long will, which is why he goes in after. Renoir himself even said that he almost lost himself in a painting and it was Aline he rescued him, so he's just following the lesson he learned from her.
Again, you are stupid, stop posting.

So everyone over 40 with a smoking habit is a cripple now?

she is cooked on the inside too, with fucked lungs she is one bad flu away from croaking

It's a recent burn, that should actually heal with time.

Renoir himself even said that he almost lost himself in a painting and it was Aline he rescued him, so he's just following the lesson he learned from her

Yeah, so Renoir is just projecting his own weakness onto his wife.

she can't breathe properly so I assume she can't walk/run too far either without hurting

*screams internally*

Am I being trolled?

Verso?

I hardly knew him

In a bout of the devs' autistic attention to detail, she actually has a different soundset to Maelle. She sounds way more pained when running/jumping/climbing, because y'know, it hurts like hell.

Sciel asks Esquie if he's got any wine after the Lampmaster fight in Act I

You just know Verso was standing behind some rock with his asshole puckered hoping Esquie wouldn't spill the beans.

Verso's room was nice, showed all his inspo.

It get better, because she actually asked Gustave and Lune, but it was Esquie that reacted first.

Oh yeah, that would make more sense.

People used to pay for lobotomy to make their women silent.

knocked Aline out of the canvas

knocked Renoir out of the canvas

knocked Alicia out of the canvas

ensured family heals and moves on

ensured Clea is happy in the epilogue

Yep, I'm thinking based

I don't care.

Clea is too old to be childless. The French have failed if they haven't produced anybody worthy of providing her with them, so I will volunteer in their stead.

girl named Alicia

goes into a land full of wonders

Oh, I see...

How far does this rabbit hole go?

No one is really sure how painting works but I imagine it's not that easy to repaint being that have lived for ages and that you have only known for less than 1% of their life span

Psychologists and psychiatrists also consider hearing voices in your head or visual hallucinations as stuff that needs heavy medication, while believing you are trapped in the wrong body is perfectly normal and should be americlapped at worldwide as stunning and brave. So excuse me if I consider their opinion worth as much as my toilet paper.

This sounds like cope from someone who received tough love and had a tantrum instead of accepting the lesson.

The joke is that you realize it only post-facto. Which is most subtle than the most of Alice in Wonderland-inspired narratives.

not yet

Does the exact same thing as me

PAINTED PEOPLE ARE REEEEEAL GET OUTTA MY CANVAS

So what's the ultra mega boss in this game? I just finished the tower

Simon, The Myrmidon of Loss.

NTA
No, you are trying to dodge a reality that the game states to your 1:1 as Clea says this is the case herself.
You decide to interpretate this as "bitches be crazy" because you want a whole some chungus dad who reels in all the crazy women.
In reality he is as afraid as Aline is in denial, and the combination is what is causing the problem, because neither is communicating properly.
The fact he decided spending 67 years in a row inside the canvas without rest stuck in a hole while he KNOWS the effects this is having on both his wife, his daughters and himself, should clue you to this immediately.

b-b-b-uht leaving ur junkie wife behind

Yes they are both garbage.
No, neither of their methods is good.
Isolating bad. Forcing the matter bad. Result: Escalation and now your daughter prefers to die living here than go back outside and put up with your unreliable shit.
It's that simple.

Picture unrelated.

delayed slash + dueliso

My turn

My turn

My turn

My turn

My turn

Noooooo I don't want to spend the rest of my life casually fucking Lune and Sciel while her husband watches!

What did Verso mean by this

So what's the ultra mega boss in this game?

Promised Consort Simon, the Divergent Star

I SUMMON POT OF GREED TO DRAW TWO ADDITIONAL PICTOS FROM MY CONVERTER

Watches

Anon, they are french. Verso is fucking Pierre while Sciel and Lune have wine and make out nearby taking turns to step in the middle f the sandwhich, if nothing else.

This anon gets it.

Result: Escalation and now your daughter prefers to die living here than go back outside and put up with your unreliable shit.

I wonder if the Dessandres will have some kind of self-realization at this point, because when you get to the point where your youngest daughter prefers death over relying on her family, it means you suck as parents.

millions of subhuman p*inted must die in the struggle for TWD

What's the appeal?

Sadly you need to be on New Game+ for this guy to not be a pushover.

How do I find a chud gf bros?

The only one that seems to be surviving the tide is the one jumping ship and letting everyone kill themselves if they want to, so probably.

no bra

no corset

slut

I like it. But I gave Lune the Messy Bun. Felt very -her.
Lune absolutely rocks Clea's dress though.

french

slut

Oxymoron, etc

Simon removes all shields

Owari da... my entire thing was having low HP and surviving with shields
And they knew people would play exactly like that

Verso explicitly calls himself make-believe. Do you think he was lying then? Why trust his old journal over his words at the start of Act 3?

I know you are baiting, but you understand what he means is that he is not actually the Verso they are trying to cling to but an image of him, an ideal that is not really the correct thing, right?

I HELP!

He's just overdramatic. Lumiere is really not a bad place to live in by fantasy standards.

There are a lot of fictional characters who have it way worse than he does. In his universe, there's no real functional difference between painted and real person and they can probably fuck each other and have kids too.

So Alicia is basically Monika

He calls the entire world make-believe though. Not just himself and the painted family.

If you think the painting people are real, you have to be a woman

Its versover

Whenever I hear an "immortality bad/burden" argument I just think of this.
youtube.com/watch?v=TwF1iri1GjQ&t=1033

If you think the painting people are not real, you have to be an aspie

I'd rather be an aspie than a woman

So what? He's a fictional character no matter what, from our perspective.

I accept your concession

this 100%

The painting people are obviously not real because they are from a video game. The 'real' version of the characters are also not real. And if god exists, you are also not real and are just a thought in His mind.

So what?

It's rather telling.
Verso might be some cold Clea hardass who thinks that painted life doesn't matter. But it's still pretty clear that Verso considers the second world second to the real world in the hierarchy of things. Even if we don't know to what extent.

I know God doesn't exist because I'm so here

He calls the situation make-believe, anon. I know it's difficult, but try to use your braincells.
Mom goes in and terraforms existing world to make a fake Paris and a fake life, grabs a bunch of soul juice and makes it look like her son.
Verso: "This is all make-believe"
Obviously. Because no matter how much she tries, it is not the city she loves, the family she has or the son she lost.
The world she is living in is imaginary, because she doesn't even live in the world that the canvas offers. She lives in a bad approximation of her real life.

Verso should just accept that he is his own person and lay down the guilt he has for Alicia

if Alicia wants to Sacrifice herself for the people of Painted Lumiere then let her be
it would be selfish of him to destroy the canvas and force her out of it while sacrificing so many lifes

Alicia did the right thing

culture war thought terminating platitudes

I beg you to think critically at some point.

When you have schizo episodes you see this. The difficult part is continuing your every day life and personal relations when you become aware you are a role in some eldritch source's Truman show. Nothing matters then but you have to keep pretending it does. Much like painted Verso does.

Yeah, but there might be Creator that created the painters (God with capital God), since the painters are just Demiurges. An existing of a higher level of being doesn't mean that you are any less real.

Clea: "Sis, don't get involved with the writers guild"
Alicia: "I will get involved with the writers guild!"
Writers guild: ALLAH AKBAR!
Verso: "stupid bitch wtf did you do!?"
Clea: "Stupid bitch wtf did you do!?"
Alicia: "Oh no! Muh brother!"
Aline: "Oh no! Muh son! Time to AN HERO INTO HIS CANVAS!"
Reinor: "Get out of the canvas and grieve like a normal person in healthier ways."
Aline: "Make me!"
*Proceeds to paint people and her version of their dead son*
Clea: "I'm only gonna mediate the bullshit between you two once, then peace out"

Nah women keep repeating that so I say women think like that

Schizo RETARD

It's NOT Verso, it's a depressed trainwreck copy of Verso, living on in a puppet theater built on top of actual Verso being trapped in his personal hell. What a lovely fucking ending.

five trillion threads

nobody has mentioned that omelette du gommage flower petals have different colors depending on who painted them

hes depressed because hes such a sissy over it and wants to guilt trip Alicia into murdering an entire city
hes the bad guy in this situation

So what? It's is a perfectly fine fantasy world to live in. It's not like he's living a world like Prince of Nothing.

Have you considered for a moment getting her cracked out mother to recreate Lumiere and it's residents in another canvas after she heals, instead of building on top of a corpse? No, ofcourse not, cause you'd have to be as retarded as Maelle.

So when you're trapped in the Canvas do you still need to eat/drink/shit/piss etc on the outside?

From my point of view, all video game characters are fictional.

Well you don't need to genocide the whole population first to think of making an infinity +1 portal gun to perform the transfer with.

it wouldnt be the same Lumiere anymore and all the residents of the old one would still die unjustly

the needs of the many overshadow the needs of the view
the Dessendre family has no right to kill them
they suffered enough

seems wildly unethical that this random family of schizos can create life as a coping mechanism but sadly there's no manor house fire 2.0 ending where they all get brutally murdered except renoir

Now you know the real reason Renoir was so sick of his wife spending all her time in the canvas.

the story seems interesting but its a shame the combat is making this game unplayable.

Pets also die
Do you never get a new pet if your old dog dies

Sing us a song, you're the piano man
Sing us a song tonight
Well, we're all in the mood for a melody
And you've got us feelin' alright

What "genocide"? They don't recall or remember shit after getting erased, they could easily be recreated in another canvas with "oh shit, didn't we just gommage?!?" memories by a professional like Aline, instead of a shitty amateur like Alicia that can barely hold a single theater together. Renoir was right all along, get the hoes off their crack pipe and they can make their fucking doll house later after the coped properly.

Writerchads were the good guys all along.

except renoir

lol
You deserve to be thrown into the house fire head first, daddy-issues boy.

I would go in the opposite direction. The minute Renoir is out of the picture, this dysfunctional family breaks anyway.

GOD I MISSED Anon Babble SO MUCH

Painters are obviously a hire form of life, just like humans are a higher form of life in comparison to ants- if you bought an ant colony and obsessed over it and your loved one destroyed it and killed all the ants because you were spending too much time with it that wouldn't be seen as egregious. The painted beings are playthings, entertainment, meant to be consumed.
You can only get mad at this line of reason if you're a vegan.

Clea* is out of the picture

FTFY

They don't recall or remember shit after getting erased, they could easily be recreated in another canvas with "oh shit, didn't we just gommage?!?" memories by a professional like Aline, instead of a shitty amateur like Alicia that can barely hold a single theater together.

You're missing a detail.
When Lune and Sciel get gommaged, they dissolve into red petals, which is from Renoir's power. When Maelle is trying to degommage them, their chroma is recondensing as red petals, before turning into gold, which is Alicia's painting power. This means she reused the same chroma they were made out of, so there's continuity.
Would a very powerful painter recreating them in a different canvas, with all their memories perfectly preserved, make them the same people? Even if the chroma is different? Does it have to be the same painter? This is clone/transporter paradox territory.

Do you never get a new pet if your old dog dies

No, of course not. People who went with Maelle would probably opt for burying their cat or dog in the pet sematary no matter how monkey pawed they'd get churned out.

a hire form of life

An existing of a higher level of being doesn't mean that you are any less real.

I agree. And even Verso probably agrees.
But no matter whether or not he is right or wrong. It still seems like he considers the painted world less important. Even if not unimportant, less important.
And lots of his self-loathing probably stems from perspective.

Far faster to cut and paste or to modify small details than to recreate. You'll know this if you try lucid dreaming and creating worlds/people or when you are painting.

I'm genuinely surprised that even 9.6% of players have the achievement for beating simon, not only because most people don't even finish a game, but he was genuinely, legitimately really difficult.

When I got him to 40% hp in phase 2, only to realize I now have to completely rethink my strategy because he auto-deletes your active party before he starts phase 3, I wasn't sure I was gona beat him because I knew I had to actually spend luminas on, max out their weapons and prepare 2 characters I completely neglected for literally my entire playthrough(monocco, sciel).

I haven't seen anyone mention the noise that plays as Verso looks up in Maelle's ending, or that he seems to be the first and only person to acknowledge the motes of light fading in and out of existence the entire game.

It is understandable that a painter would be desensitized to the existential horror of their powers over time, especially someone like Clea. But the suffering of an ant in comparison to a human is far lesser, while the suffering of a Lumierian is by all measures the same as a human in a higher state of existence.

The Painters
The Writers
Then the Wage Slaves, the Hirest form of life.

I'm certain a large number of players both switched it to easy mode and cheesed the fuck out of it.

lumerians can only reproduce with the consent of a painter who assigns them chroma
they therefore do not meet one of the essential conditions to be defined as life, they're more like viruses

the noise that plays as Verso looks up in Maelle's ending

No, it has been mentioned, and it's pretty clear cut that she's repainting/manipulating him. It's ambiguous if she's also puppeting the few people in the concerto that aren't copy pasted NPCs, since they act very out of character for being in a still destroyed Lumiere.

Maelle would probably opt for burying their cat or dog in the pet sematary no matter how monkey pawed they'd get churned out

Nah she'd clone her animals

He dies to one hit.

Why does fake renoir even kill expeditioners? Their mission is to kill the paintress but what they dont know is she's the one helping them so why does he even bother stopping them? Or was this a one time thing because Maelle was with them?

Alicia is a fire form of life.

Clea couldn't give two fucks about her family. It's Renoir that wants his family together no matter the cost. Neither Clea nor Aline seem to care very much.
And Alicia has bigger problems.

I beat him by blowing him the fuck up with Medallum and Stendhal while it was still a thing. You could probably still one shot him in both phases with more prep work.

lumerians can only reproduce with the consent of a painter

But that's not true, it depends on the race.
Gestrals don't reproduce, and they don't get consciously repainted by Verso, they are brought back from the river because that was established when they were first drawn.
Do you think Aline hand paints every fetus and newborn in Lumiere for hundreds of generations, and when she's forced to hold back Renoir and can barely protect them from his gommage? Aline set the framework when creating the first Lumierians, and they run on their own free will since.

Painted Renoir didn't attack previous expeditions, 60 for example reached the Paintress just fine without his intervention.
I think I missed some detail about the landing zone for Expedition 33, I think Lune told them to change course for some reason, and Verso was stalking them, so it had to be about Maelle.

It's an easy game to 100% once you begin to abuse the pictos, but I guarantee you that the majority of those people used Stendhal.

Died in two burn ticks. Oops. I'll probably re-do the fight later this week

He doesn't wanna chance it, I wouldn't either. Someone like Simon already slipped through, if he wasn't convinced he'd probably take a swipe at Aline too.

The only thing that isn't clear to me is at which point did painted Renoir go from trying to stop the paintress with Verso, to trying to stop the expeditioners. And also why Renoir and Verso would be on Expedition Zero in the first place, since surely Aline didn't create them as blank slates without awareness that they are her family.

Aside from a whole 23% actually reaching the ending, what surprises me the most is that 10~% of the players did all the extra super boss Simon, Clea, Painted Love stuff. As well as getting all Lost Gestrals. All the Nevron Quests. Gathering all Feet.

But only 5.5% got all music records and journals.
What?

Would the kind of players who'd beat all the super bosses. Beat all the minigames. Find all the hidden korok shitters. And do all side quests. Not also find the records and journals? Yet only half as many players did.
I find that disconnect a bit odd myself. But I suppose I just don't understand people.

Did they patch Stendhal or something? I beat him yesterday. I looked it up afterwards, and there's a strategy to one shot him with maelle(she's broken as hell), just takes some odd prep with pictos and having her go solo.

Thats lame as hell though, hes honestly a really fun and tense fight, and learning his parries is satisfying as hell if you don't just auto-blow him up with certain strats. I'm sure most players are doing that though.

They should make it that even if you would 1 shot him in phase 2, his health stops at 40%, then he does the party wipe, so any strat-cheesers are forced into at least phase 3 which would shred anyone that hasn't learned his moveset once he goes berserk.

They never wanted to stop the paintress. The world got fractured and they started looking for Aline.

youtube.com/watch?v=dffRUOBNGB8

Visages is the best boss fight

How did this game develop such a cringe fanbase so quickly?

Could it be because of Verso's journal? I'm not positive but iirc, verso's journal does not appear in the list greyed out like the rest, then when you get it, it just sort of appears, maybe some players didn't realize they were missing his journal? Otherwise yeah, that is pretty odd.

They should make it that even if you would 1 shot him in phase 2, his health stops at 40%, then he does the party wipe, so any strat-cheesers are forced into at least phase 3 which would shred anyone that hasn't learned his moveset once he goes berserk.

Man it's not that difficult to break the game with any character, Maelle is just easier to abuse than the others. Even if your idea was implemented, my Verso and Monoco were equally cracked. Only Sciel was a dedicated support character (which she is by far the best at).

If anything, the DLCs should tackle different outcomes

Gustave lives, he remembers Sophie's words which ends in the Paintress being defeated but not killed, they join forces, release Simon and he becomes a late party member, they kill Renoir, after coping with Maelle and Verso for a while, Aline and Alicia leave

I did a NG3 run just to replay it again over the weekend and even with Stendhal he's real tough

Expedition Zero was a search and rescue effort. The goal of the expeditions changed once people took notice of the gommage.

Fun fact: they said in a recent interview that the flower effect of the gommage was kinda improvised.

CharaDesigner made them with red flower collars

Whoa that's cool, could be an homage to last year's departees

Wdym, they're made of petals?

Sure, let's go with that

Being a small team sounds invaluable.

I exploded him in one-shot well after the stendhal nerf, using gommage. It was fun to set up and execute, but I also want to try the counterattack method now too. I believe you when you say it's satisfying. Might see if there's a mod to respawn him.

As for them changing the fight, I sincerely doubt they'll do that. They've come out and said explicitly that being able to break the game is intended and part of the fun.

Gustave living and Maelle maybe actually taking Alicia's letter into consideration would be enough to steer towards a less tragic end.
I don't think they can save Simon though.

but he was genuinely, legitimately really difficult.

That would be the case if it wasn't so easy to break the game with Maelle. Let's be honest here, most people who got this achievement just Stendhal'd him. Even after the Medalum fix and Stendhal nerf it's easily possible.

Yeah its a really flexible game so it leads to a lot of broken builds. I was having a lot of fun with burn builds, absolutely shredding shit. Sciel does have crazy support abilities, I just never realized it until I finally used her for the Simon fight. Fortune's Fury's and intervention is pretty nuts. And of course All set, best support by far.

The whole Verso thing reminds me of that one hypothetical situation I read on this site years ago about the world turning into a utopia but there's a single person that's getting dragged into the center of the earth and tortured forever to keep it that way

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ones_Who_Walk_Away_from_Omelas
It's 4 pages long, just read it.

Yeah, he even states this in his journal:

She left us all to drown ourselves, while she can drown alone. This bitch was/is suicidal. Man, REAL Renoir is the goat in this story. Just a guy who lost his son and wants to grieve properly with still 3 members of his family left. He went in himself and got imprisoned for 67 fucking years with this mad woman. I mean she painted herself a fake familiy and yet the PAINTED version of Alicia is burnt? That is fucked up and tells you everything you need to know about this woman. Renoir est BASÉD

Damn, I only wanted to greentext the quote

She left us all to drown ourselves, while she can drown alone.

fml

I would like that, but this is a french/greek tragedy; they won't do a third ending
But yeah, if the dessandre family weren't such fuck ups they could have easily reached a compromise

delete verso

bring back gustave, and literally everyone else

keep canvas as is, everyone in there gets a good life from now on

maelle gets to come and go from time to time, enjoying everyone's company

It just goes to show that most people are really utilitarian at the end of the day

I just want to see Verso and Gustave interacting...

he was really fucking sick and tired of the crazy bitches in his family

"i've just spent 67 years trapped under the monolith i am NOT doing this AGAIN!"

What about Verso's soul? Is he just still forced to paint? Keep in mind that it's still his canvas.

dont forget some sort of replacement for the soul of verso. it would fit with the theme of letting go while letting the memory live on. maelle could release the tired sliver of verso and replace her own sliver of her soul within, thus adopting the painted world as her own.

Renoir asking Aline why she drew so many Africans in Lumiere.

We really don't know the rules of it, but I'm assuming it's either not necessary or something else can replace his soul (otherwise there'd be hundreds of paintings of the whole family with pieces of their souls in them). would be nice; just leave a part of maelle's soul in there at all times so she can feel at home, even if she's outside
Again, they won't fucking do it because they love misery

Deleting Verso is the hardest compromise to make for Aline and Alicia. Saving the canvas and not drowning yourself in it is an easier compromise to make. But it also requires respecting Verso's memory and not dragging his legacy down in grief.
If Gustave never met a tragic end, Alicia wouldn't have suffered the same trauma twice and would be able to cope better.
Gustave most likely would have to fight Verso and then Alicia in order to save both the canvas and the Dessendres because they may be unwilling to compromise. Only by resolving the family's struggle can the painting be saved.

the only reason gustave was even there, was to "do an aeris" anon

He'll get better once they kick out the dysfunctional family

Tomorrow CUMS

The pain of the boy comes from the sheer desecration of the painting. It's meant to be a place of joy and painting Lumiere did not detract from it. The Fracture, Gommages and nonstop killer Nevrons are what ruined it.

because they love misery

No, because they introduced characters with deep flaws and traumas they aren't willing to overcome as they are also basically gods.

100 years in the canvas is like a week in normal time

this technology seems extremely dangerous so why did the paintfags ever expose their kids to it

friend of mine was showing me the game since he thinks i would liek it
and i agree i liked what he showed me but
picrel
that was the area he showed me the game on, some late game post campaign optional area
is it supposed to look like that? with that fog everywhere?
i told my friend but he chalked it to having a shitty computer and playing in med settings

Yes. The story wouldn't make any sense otherwise

have superpowers

your kids too

teach them how to handle them instead of fucking up one day

Rank these based on level of suffering.

Painted Verso

Painted Alicia

Painted Clea

Simon

Sciel

Lune

Gustave

Renoir

Looks like the snow area. The game looks pretty good in most places.

superpower is creating fantasy worlds that are better in real life and get you addicted and then you die irl

wow, sign me and my kids up!

maelle gets to come and go from time to time, enjoying everyone's company

Renoir is afraid of Alicia getting addicted to huffing paint and being stuck in the canvas AGAIN.
Would you trust an ex-alcoholic with "a few drops here and there"

the gradual shift from gustave towards the shit family drama hurts me from giving the story a 10. whenever gus was suffering and persevering on screen, it was so good. he literally represents the city of lumiere. gustave is likely named after gustave eiffel, the designer of his namesake tower, the symbol of of the city of lights, aka city of lumiere. in his first main encounter, the theme is "stand up, for lumiere!" which has the leitmotif of the lumiere theme in it which gives the feeling that with gustave, it is the city itself fighting for its survival. Was it because the Charlie Cox money ran out that they killed him?

Ive been a versofag day 1. But now i realize he can live 60 more years for Maelle. She deserves it desu

Painted Verso>Simon>Painted Alicia>Sciel>Painted Clea>Renoir>Gustave>Lune

it was "flying manor" a side area for what he told me
i saw him in the open world and it looked better but the lightning and that "fog" inside looked like crap

i like how you excluded maelle cause i think we can all agree, she had the LEAST suffering.

if time moves like 100x faster in the canvas than the outside world then several years will have passed each time she leaves and comes back and pretty soon all her friends in the canvas will be dead

I don't. That's why I said "If they weren't such fuck ups"
They will continue to do that in other canvasses no problem, but this one has verso painted all over it so they can't be trusted

You let Gustave die and lied to me for the whole expedition? Yeah nah. Play a tune for me, bitch. And smile for us this time.

I think it's the flying manor, the part where you defeat the 3 ze-something (the stronger versions of the first boss).
Either way yeah that does look on shit settings but that area is pretty bleak to begin with.

Good thing they're paintings. Aline already had the power of giving them immortality/non aging to her fake family; maelle could easily do the same for everyone (with its consequences, of course)

Didn't include her and Aline because their suffering, losing a relative, is only a part of what Renoir deals with, and less suffering than dying like the Lumierians, so they'd obviously be at the bottom.

stuck for eternity as some 16 year old girl's dolls in her playhouse

grim

reach The Chosen Path

Who's soloing this canvas

Maelle, easy, meet Stendhal, bitch

Who's soloing this canvas

no Maelle anymore

UH

Had to dust off Lune against the Stalact

Thank god it has the easiest patterns and she can hit Fire / Ice at will.

Verso solos the Contortionist

This thing is made of pure nightmares holy fuck

Are we getting a sequel with Clea vs the writers?

painted verso on top for sure. he was brought to life to know that he is the cause of all the suffering yet has no right to intervene on any of it cause hes not the real verso. he represents the saying "what if verso was still here? what would he say to us that we are all hurting ourselves due to him?" if you really wanna analyze it, it was never about verso, it was the dessedre family being terrible selfish people making the death of verso about themselves instead. painted verso had to watch his "real" family aka his painted family go through the worst fates imaginable for these selfish assholes.

But you'd be killing other people as well
Genocide is wrong

cheater + steeled strike. the two piece setup for endgame verso.

Painted Clea completely nulls this argument.
He can just kill himself if he wants to, immortality be damned.

ckea has painter powers given to her, just like painted alicia and painted renoir. verso is sorta just normal compared to his painted family.

Currently running the Call of Duty Verso.
Pew pew pew Dueliso pew pew pew pew pew Follow up

The genocide of Lumierians stops here.
If you would please play the piano, PAINTEDso...

I'm sending this cocksucker to the piano mines as soon as I can as a punishment for being "too slow" to save Gustave.

i wanted to do that too, but ended up giving monoco and sciel like 700-800 lumina points between the two of them. verso got the least for me.

He knows his family and him are copies of literal gods

The world they live in can be erased on a whim

everyone is being slowly erased, exempt for his family, who hate him, every other person he meets gets erased or killed by his father

Can't sleep, the moment he closes his eyes, he starts to experience restless nightmares

Can't even kill himself, as he is immortal

The only release is for the canvas world to be erased

It's not just "he lived for a long time" he lived for a long time in constant torture

Also, as I painfully found out, Cheater doesn't work with Dueliso.

he represents the saying "what if verso was still here? what would he say to us that we are all hurting ourselves due to him?"

Hasn't thought of that, shit, that's fucking depressing.

He died for narrative reasons, paralleling the sacrifice of a brother figure, removing the character most likely to save the day and to make us players feel the loss of someone important.

Renoir. Since all of the above are not real

yeah, free turns dont really work well with multiple sources. if you see the line "X plays immediately", it means they get no followup turn. i believe this also works with natural turns being after one another too but i could be wrong. This is due to a built in infinite turn prevention limit i believe meaning everyon is only ever able to take two turns max in a row. Cheater essentially gives verso dualiso without needing dualiso, so you can still use him as a base attack-tard but without the damage reduction(dualiso has half the damage stat than other weapons) and better weapon passives. fun fact, sciel is able to bypass free turn prevention limit with her intervention. on her second turn, she pulls someone else between Sciel and her "third" turn breaking up her turns into two parts and bypassing the multiple turn prevention. also works when she is revived and gets an immediate turn with the revive pico which prevents her from taking a followup turn cause her taking her revived turn counts as a followup turn itself, but if she uses intervention, it converts her turn into a fresh turn for another character who CAN take two turns now. if you couldnt tell, i enjoyed testing around with this shit.

Omega-Giga-Ultra-HOLY FUCKING based.

She did nothing wrong.

wants to die

can finally age and die at the end

instead of now killing himself or just living out the rest of one normal lifetime he uses his ultra god-tier lying powers to identify maelle's one lie at the end and then himself lies - using her lie as justification to erase EVERYONE

eat shit esquie, enjoy not spending time with noco monoco, get unfertilized sciel and lune, hope you understand that this is all because you didn't let me fuck my painted sister *shit eating grin*

bravo

of now killing himself

See, he's not allowed to do that, that'd get I. The way of Alicia's fantasy.
I don't think you understood that ending.

Based reductionist retard, except Renoir is a painter as well.

Every painter who paints sentient beings is morally culpable for the suffering they cause.

clea explicitly stated to be the only one who can paint over others' creations

one of the records is possible, and quite easy, to miss (lettre a maelle)
a few of the journals dont appear in the journal entries until you find them, ones named "unknown" in particular

Nice, now explain how she made him mortal then!
Verso is her creation now, because she remade him herself.

Was she? Clea painted over Simon to send him to clap Aline, but didn't she paint over him again?

Didn't this short story basically just describe the core dilemma behind the entire game?

so you're saying our verso did in fact get to die anyways, and maelle end verso is just another attempt at making a verso, making his genocide choice pointless?

Verso can't die, but she took his chroma and tampered with it si now he belongs to her and can do whatever the fuck she wants, as seen in her ending.

That's the cathedral of the flying manor. Way more fog than in my game. Brighter lights too. Not that mine was dark.
Guess his game settings must have been pretty different from mine.

one of the records is possible, and quite easy, to miss (lettre a maelle)

How do you miss it? By rushing the story without camping? Don't you just get it by resting?

Aside from surface level similarities, not really

Lumiere isn't a utopia

its inhabitants are not aware of child Verso who is maintaining the world, and thus choosing to keep cognitive dissonance

they cannot choose to walk away from Omelas, if they do they vanish

child Verso isn't tortured, he's distraught from the carnage going on by his family, but left alone with his painting he'd happily keep it going

it is painted Verso who is tormented, but his existence isn't mechanically tied to the survival of the world, it only is so indirectly because of his Painter not-family being idiots

destroy object that both his wife and teenage daughter love

He wouldn't ever hear the end of it, that's short way to a divorce and kid that doesn't talk to you

Isn't that also the plot point of Snowpiercer?

you have to "check up on the others" between the first and second axon iirc
i can see some people rushing that

suffering of few vs the suffering of many is a popular theme to tackle in media is it has reflection in real world equivalents.

The director said that the french sci-fi book The Horde of Counterwind (la Horde du contrevent) was an inspiration for the game.
It's about a team in a wind-battered world (think Arrakis with storms) walking endlessly towards the source of the Wind to find out what the fuck is happening.

Imagine if the god of your world would give up on your world if her brother-clone didn't play piano for her.

Now I'm interested...

Nevermind just realized it ain't translated from French, fuck...

i think the anon that mentioned this before said they never find the source and it was just about the journey? i think that would have been better for this game too if we never find out it was all due to a schizo artfag family.

frenchrights.com/the-horde-of-counterwind

Rights sold to Germany, Italy, and Russia

My bad, I didn't even check if it was available in other languages

The Horde of Counterwind (la Horde du contrevent)

Is this novel actually not available in anything but French?

would have been cooler if we never interact with the real family directly at all and only see them through maelle's flashback and time in the real world. painted renoir was better than real renoir.

European game based on an untranslated obscure novel

is kino

Weird this happened twice.