What if she just wrote a clear message on the Monolith instead of numbers

Yea like why don't they just teleport Frodo to mountain doom?

boy a retard with no reading comprehension. magic can be magic so long as it doesn't start fucking with the plot by bending reality, opening portals to other worlds and altering time.

Aline is fucked in the head, when the crew reaches her she's wondering if she dreamt the fire and actually Verso is alive
Not like she is actually understanding what is happening around her

isn't Harry Potter the biggest magic-related IP

I don't know I don't read slop. I just laugh when mommy JK makes the trannies seethe.
the most popular things are usually dogshit. Disney remakes are in the top grossing cinema releases for example.

she only had to write the truth once in any of the 80+ years or whatever.

What would she even write ?
what possible combination of words would make any fucking difference in that situation ?

The first expeditions weren't hunting her, that started late. And i don't know why you talking about 80 years. The fracture happened only 67 years ago, after she already spent quite a lot of time in the canvas

magic can be magic so long as it isn't magical

if you don't know then why are you talking like an expert on magic in media?

it's cute you're half implying you read anything period

Keep in that mind that couldn't be the actual truth, that they are paintings.
It has to be something to manipulate them into fighting Renoir. But again, first expeditions weren't hunting the her. And she was losing her mind with time.

when you start tacking on reality warping shit, your plot always falls apart into slop.
It doesn't matter if you explain it with "magic" or make up some bullshit "scientific" explanation.
the point is you've just ruined your plot. it a mess no intelligent person will take seriously.

how is it ruined? the plot is literally a world created magically via painting, what's wrong with that?

the thing is, they know they're paintings
they know they're made of chroma, literally fucking color, they know what they are made of can be manipulated (lumina). They know there are gods that can delete them (the paintress).
The only thing they're not aware of is that there is a higher dimension than theirs where those gods come from, but that's not a particularly useful information.

Also, Aline doesn't really care about renoir, not enough to mobilize the people of lumière. She has immortal super sayians she could send, she doesn't because it makes no difference. She doesn't believe they have the potential to change anything - and they don't. If they defeat renoir, he'll just come back. Keeping him trapped is actually her best solution to delay the inevitable.

It doesn't really make sense.
She's supposed to be fighting the dad who's slowly erasing shit from the world in order to force her out of her schizo episode and she's using her power to protect some of her creations.
It doesn't really mesh with her giant puppet standing up once a year, painting a number and fake people of that age disappearing.
Like, they started out with an intriguing hook first - the concept of gommage causing people to slowly go extinct - then tried to write the story around that and it devolved into this lame family drama.

the thing is, they know they're paintings

they don't know until Act 3, did you even play the game? lol

try reading more than 7 words next time

do you need to read that out lout to yourself again to process how stupid it is?

sorry to be the one to have tell you anon but this is a 18+ website

then tried to write the story around that and it devolved into this lame family drama

I know. it's amazing people defend this slop when I've never seen an interesting premise squandered and dropped this hard.

it's stupid because science can't explain it

Yeah the word you're looking for, actually, is "magic". Stupid is what i would call someone who can't grasp that

they know they're made of chroma, literally fucking color, they know what they are made of can be manipulated (lumina).

I mean, on it's face it's a paint-themed fantasy setting. You can easily assume chroma and lumina are equivalent of souls/mana/chakra/materia whatever.
Even if they're aware that they're painting they don't know what it actually means because they have no concept of not being a painting.

Harry Potter is inconsistent in the internal logic and contradicts itself almost every book to what was being said in the prior book. There's Soft Magic and Hard Magic, hard magic has rules to enforce story telling and to make it so you can't just go "wizard did it" to every question. Dungeons and Dragons is usually Hard Magic compared to something like BBC One's Merlin series, that's very soft magic. Sure it has rules and it can't break everything but its not very well explained to the viewer if at all what those limitations are.

soft magic and hard magic

no, there's magic and there's bad sci fi with wizards
here's a good rule of thumb : if it has a strong set of rules and is figured out through experimentation, it's probably not fucking magic !
what "magic system" retards don't understand is that the point of magic in storytelling isn't to explain how your super cool protag is slinging fireballs and outplaying his retarded enemies in your not-at-all-shounenslop fantasy, it is to create unique premises that the reader accepts on their face (suspension of disbelief) so that we can see humans in a completely different setting, and the unique stories that could come about from such a setting.
Nobody fucking cares how many mana points it costs you to cast cone of cold. It is not interesting.

A setting where the wizards have been systemically figuring out magic for years cataloguing things into their scrolls and books.

ITS NOT Magic! That's not realistic magic!

Yawn, you are really gay and tarded even fucking greeks and egyptians were doing that fucking shit with their belief systems for centuries and so forth. Magic is magic because its fantastical and bends the reality to its will compared to what's normally possible through mundane means of technology. For example you have your rituals of summoning that are well written out, you also have rituals of banishing, alchemy is certainly no different. There's usually just a magical element that allows the thing to happen without that magical thing, you won't have magic.

Soft and hard magic are established terms, no one cares about your schizo ramblings.

if it bends reality guess what, it has no rules retard, because it could bend its own rules
you are fucking stupid and don't understand words or what they mean
established by retards, who fucking cares ?

muh magic isn't scientific essays

Holy fuck...

Nah, you are just gay and retarded, lmao.

no arguement, doesn't understand what words mean, probably only reads china slop and litrpg

you are subhuman

why dont they fix everything with magic

Says the person who says no that's not magic when it clearly is, lmao. You are retarded and gay, below the level of any common intelligence.

established by retards, who fucking cares ?

You are a retard and no one cares what you think.

What would she even write?

"cause under here"
"evil under monolith"

There are no evil characters in this game. Maybe Verso and Super Saiyajin Maelle but that's debatable.

Verso is the least morally evil character in the game.

he knows the Painting will be destroyed by Renoir, completely, from the start, he knows the only winning thing is to save his mother and sister from the painting.

all other avenues lead to a destroyed painting AND his dead sister and mother (or the real verso's at least)

he's committed to the one act that has any lasting real good impact.

What if she just wrote a clear message on the Monolith instead of numbers

If she was thinking and communicating clearly, then none of the plot would have happened. There's a suitable reason in-story that she's not behaving rationally, but I'll focus on the fact that E33 is a tragedy. "What if they didn't manifest this lack of virtue that causes the consequence at the end?" Well, then it wouldn't be a tragedy.

they don't know until Act 3

Lune tells you in the prologue that Lumina and Chroma are the fundamental elements of the universe. It's common knowledge among NPCs that you can draw "Pictos" onto things to change their nature. One NPC says he refuses to draw pictos on himself for existential reasons, and sticks to drawing them on machines.

They are fundamentally aware that they're in a painting, even if they don't phrase it that way. They handle their existential dread about this exactly the same way that you and I deal with our inevitable deaths and the possibility that we're being simulated on a mechanism that has limitations which render the universe unsustainable on a long enough timescale. IE, in day to day conversation, you and I wouldn't say, "It's a simulation. God will throw this all into the lake of fire. Heat Death coming, baybee" even though that is the conception which grips us in moments when we think about it.

how is it stupid and contrived?

They are fundamentally aware that they're in a painting

No you idiot, to them that's just reality, the same way we have our own reality. They can't draw the conclusion that they are a painting based on that because they can't fathom something like that.

If the world being fiction ruins it for you, then... Well... You might want to sit down for this one, buddy. Got your tard helmet on? Good. Okay, whew. Now, I know you don't handle things that upset you very well, so I'm gonna have to ask you to brace yourself for this one. See... And now, I don't mean nothing personal by this, but... Well I really thought you could tell that fiction is fake, so I didn't think this needed explaining at first.

See, the story is about letting go of illusions so you can live your life. And the story is an illusion. Now hold on, I don't just mean they're in a painting. I mean it's a story. Sciel isn't a real person. Maelle isn't your little sister. There's no expedition. It's all fiction. The city of Lumiere doesn't exist.

No, no, I hear you. Yes, you saw it on the TV. But... Well... Sometimes they put things on the TV that aren't really there. Remember that movie you saw where the aliens blew up the White House? Still there. Didn't happen. It's like that with Expedition 33, see. Because it's fiction. Now, them being in a painting doesn't mean they're more fictitious. Because they're already fake. Got it, sport? Good. Good. Glad we had "The Talk."

this, nobody cares about how magic works ever, when a story starts explaining how and why magic works it's always biggest waste of time
this faggot probably likes prequals because it explains the force with midichlorians
or some dumb shit
how the fuck a metaphor of painters bringing paintings to "life" is not enough to these autists is beyond me

They are fundamentally aware that they're in a painting

no they don't lmao.
When maelle reveals the truth to lune and sciel, they comment they had no idea there was another reality outside of their own. They thought that was just how the world naturally works.

the game go out of it way to show you that she don't even understand what she is doing anymore, she is basically insane.

Because this magic has some rules, they just don't fit into your tiny narrow definition of magic.

You can easily assume chroma and lumina are equivalent of souls/mana/chakra/materia whatever.

Or you could assume that the things called "Light" and "Color" that are used to draw "Pictos" to alter a thing's essence are Light and Color used to draw Pictos, as explicitly explained twice in the prologue. Once by a scientist and once by an engineer.

They can't draw the conclusion that they are a painting

Ask yourself why they call her the "paintress." Why do they use the painting term "Gommage" and why do they say she's "Painting" the number when there's nothing about what the colossus at the monolith is doing that looks remotely like painting.
In all likelihood, they knew in explicit terms that they were in a painting before the fracture, and now they know it in implicit terms.

Ask yourself why Renoir doesn't lay it out as "Did you know we're in a painting?" and instead tells the expeditioners his worldview. "Don't you see? She doesn't paint death, she paints life!" Because they comprehend that she is their demiurge. It's a JRPG quest to kill god. They know that she's responsible for the fabric of their universe, and the linguistic terms that they use to describe this are painting related.

to them that's just reality, the same way we have our own reality

We openly and explicitly discuss our reality as a simulation and there are reasons for doing so. Are you going to likewise deny that we really can see it that way? Lune is a natural philosopher of some kind and Gustav is an engineer. The painter in the prologue explicitly states people are uncomfortable about painting for existential reasons because of its association with "The Paintress" who isn't observed to be painting anything. That's three specialists in universe all describing the universe as a painting. Lune does not express shock at learning that she's in a painting. Guess why? Because it's not a revolutionary concept to her.

Maybe she wanted Lumierians to live in relative ignorance unaware of the painter conflict or even their existence. They would have gommaged anyway so might as well tell them when will it happen. I don't think even her painted family knew of her nature until fracture.

What if she just wrote a clear message on the Monolith instead of numbers

Then there would be no video game.

They really should never have had Maelle/Alicia write an actual message on the Monolith. Having her write a real message on the Monolith kinda undermines the entire fucking game.

Everything can be adressed by "it's a painting-themed fantasy setting" which I said and you conveniently cut out. It's not exactly a secret since it has literal sentient brushes.
Eternal Sonata uses a lot of music-themed terms since it's a music-themed game.

Yes, they have magical powers because it's a fantasy setting.

I think you have to look at it from Alicia and Aline's perspectives. Aline is trying to keep the canvas the canvas. She is trying to preserve the canvas because by doing so she is preserving her dead son.
Alicia does not share this motivation. Alicia treats the canvas as her world because she has adopted it as her own. She doesn't really care that the painting was originally Verso's; she cares that this canvas gave her a life that she can be happy about. She's trying to save the canvas, but not necessarily preserve it; she doesn't care about the canvas as a way to preserve Verso the same way her mom does.
In that context, it makes sense that Aline isn't treating the canvas like a canvas, because she is trying to live inside the world Verso created with the chunk of him that still exists. She wants the world live as it did (as much as it can with Renoir/Clea) sabotaging the whole thing). Alicia doesn't care about this and is content to treat the world like a toy instead.

Knowing what you know and starting it over again and it's amazing all the little details that you see and realize just how many times did Verso lie, but you understand that all of them were necessary. Just kino

bro can't cope with the fact that magic is real LMAO

No.

What if she just wrote a clear message on the Monolith instead of numbers

Like what?
And consider that Aline has zero faith in the people of lumiere ever being able to oppose Renoir. She is just mourning. She isn't trying to work with lumiere.

it's probably not fucking magic

Dumb fucking retard, read a fantasy novel or two.

And consider that Aline has zero faith in the people of lumiere ever being able to oppose Renoir. She is just mourning. She isn't trying to work with lumiere.

Because she doesn't actually care fore the lumerians, none of the family members do. They are just a coping mechanism for their grief and literally discarded when not needed anymore.

Was she unironically hiding inside of the chair? The chair is pretty bulky so I guess it could be done, but even if so it must have been a tight fit.

That anon is obnoxious but he isn't wrong. If it has rules, its science by the literal definition. And by its own definition, isn't magic anymore. Specially in universe. Hence why E33 is based, the characters treat their in universe magic as science because it has rules. Gustave is a chroma engineer who created the lumina converter and all.

I DON'T CARE

What's she gonna do, write a fucking book on the monolith?

What if Renoir just told them everything on the beach

I think it was said or implied somewhere, maybe in a log, that he tried doing that with older expeditions but they didn't believe him and thought he was an agent of the paintress. Rightfully so since that painted renoir was a paintress creation but at the same time it was ironic because he was telling the truth.

If it has rules, its science by the literal definition. And by its own definition, isn't magic anymore.

This definition was invented in the 1950s by salty sci-fi writers mad they were considered the same genre fiction as fantasy, and is historically inconsistent with how magic was treated throughout history.

since moving the painting out of the country wasn't an option it's wireless signal has infinite range

Expeditions were actually useful to Aline since the expeditioners killed by nevrons had their chromas stuck and didn't go to Renoir unlike gommaged people.

So why didn't she ask the lumierien to send all their people who reached their last age to expeditions? Instead of only a part of it.

JRPG mongrels when a story isnt cleat dark and white

the people in lumiere would just go "tl;dr"

that chroma didn't go to Aline either
I think Clea painted over pClea and forced her to make nevrons so they would kill expeditioners

>JRPG mongrels when a story isnt cleat dark and white

The most baffling part of this whole thing is that E33 *is* black and white, literally and figuratively as well as by name (Clair Obscur).

story too Maelle'o dramatic for my tastes

Actually, from the interviews, it's clear that the writer concepted "artist entering a canvas" first rather than starting from the gommage.

what are we getting friday?

I just fucking realized that EVERY member of Expedition 33 is 32 years old because Maelle is 16+16 years old.

dick in your mouth

skim thread

How did you guys managed to get baited so hard?

I'll just ignore everything the game tells me

yeah the story makes no sense

This game is great, it makes brainlets expose themselves quite easily.

Yes but it doesn't go to renoir either, which makes the stalemate last longer.
If every lumierien who reached 32 went to the expedition instead of waiting another year and getting gommaged maybe the paintress would manage to save them for a bit longer.

Kepler has a fairly large portfolio of studios they're publishing for at this point. Doubt its anything 33 related this soon.

Aline is stated to be a better painter than Renoir. Any time they tug of war over the chroma she tended to win. Thats why locking the chroma away benefits Renoir. Aline is weakening faster than he is trying hold everything together vs just deleting it. And seemed much frailer IRL where her lack of taking care of herself and overuse of the painting is withering her.

The gommaged chroma didn't go to Renoir to begin with. He could gommage people, but being stuck under the monolith meant he couldn't access chroma beyond his cage. Note that being stuck under the monolith happened after he had already created the Axons. The stalemate was because Aline could use the gommaged chroma; without it her powers weaken before Renoir's simply because of how much more time she spent in the canvas compared to Renoir. Clea's solution to break the stalemate was creating the nevrons to seal the chroma, denying it to Aline and allowing Renoir to overpower her faster.

Why don't the Dessendres just get over it?

Not everyone is autistic Clea.

Humans with godlike creation powers who have lived far longer then the average human if yo combine their irl age with the time spent in paintings, and you expect them to just get over it? They had no chance.

listen to Aline's journal, it explains why

Literally just get over it

They’re not in the mood

yeah its a plothole
and?

Maman was too le depressed

She deserved better

Why didn't they just put Aline's hand in a jar of water so she would piss herself and have to leave the Canvas?

In a similar vein, how can Renoir stand straight with his arm outstretched for days(weeks?months?) without horrible cramps?

Is there an explanation for why Verso didn't side with Renoir in the final fight outside of gameplay reasons? They wanted the same thing

Especially since Maelle does something similar after you finish her side quest. That said, Aline was losing her mind and focusing on holding Renoir back while maintaining the Canvas; it's possible she couldn't muster more than that at the time.

Primarily because he was still in shock after ejecting his mother and the subsequent end of the world; Alicia had to physically drag him along when leaving Lumière and he's mentally pulled along from then until the end.

And on a more personal level he thought Alicia was Hero selflessly trying to save the world, not an addict desperately securing her next fix while running from reality.

He just wanted to kick his dad's ass alongside his friend monoco for everything he's done, it's harmless anyway.

Verso lost it after seeing Aline on the floor in the glimpse into reality. It brought home that Maelle would, in his view, waste away within the Canvas and that his own existence was a farce.

Verso originally wanted the painted world to simply exist without the fuckery of the Painters. His fatalism was only because he felt that was impossible. Maelle provided what he originally thought was a third option after she regained her memories. It's why he was so torn with having to put down painted Alicia and painted Clea, because it meant he was alone regardless of what Maelle said. The painted family was his real family, not the Painters.
It was only when he saw the image of Aline and the possibility of reaching the core of the Canvas that he switched again, because he finally realized Maelle was just another self-serving addict doing the same thing as Aline.

Lune and Sciel don't resurrect in Act 3, Alicia creates copies of them like Aline did with her family. the ones we were used to play with are dead dead.

Technically yes, the game never explores that deeper, they can still tell Verso secrets that Maelle wouldn't know.

While technically true, their chroma was fresh enough that their entire self(brain wave pattern, soul or whatever) was carried over.
So in practice they're alive again.

she's so fucked in the head, probably nothing
she's more likely to spout Anon Babble nonsense like "niggers tongue my anus" or something

wow no shit sherlock

Im more and more convinced the true antagonist of the whole game is Aline, I know shes crazy/mourning etc but to see your other child suffer so many loses and tragedies over many years of being "born again" and to do jack shit just because "my other kid died". also, this whole expedition shit is suuuuch a convoluted way to achieve goal fuck me.

Aline is the actual villain, but she didn't know Alicia had been reborn as Maelle. Even when the party confronted her, she thought Maelle was another of Renoir's creations.

I see, I just assumed that she knew but yeah now that you said that I remember. but thats pretty fucked up that you can create "VR" and dont know what is npc and what can be someone from your "dimension" "plugged in".

they will once they take Renoirpill

It's not. It's just another anon grasping at straws to justify why they hate something popular so they can feel unique and important.

Like to an extent, I get when magic systems can feel unsatisfying because they just act like generic catch-alls that can do whatever the plot needs with no rules but that's only really the case when that magic is pushed as the framework that everything revolves around whereas here, it's really not the point. All we need to know is that it's a fabricated canvas world where the painters make the rules and hold the power. It has nothing to do with how individual characters are using magic to solve their problems so you don't need some hyper detailed explanation for why the Paintress can only give them a number instead of outright telling people "hey, my husband is trying to wipe you all out and I'm using every bit of strength I can muster to stop him from doing it all in one go." All we need to know is that there are two clashing entities that are exerting power over one another to limit each other in a battle over the fate of the canvas. The specifics don't matter because they aren't the point. All we need to know is that all she can do is paint a number to warn them of who she can't save this year.

This is pretty easy to explain. The entire reason Aline could only give a number was because Renoir was exerting control and limiting what she could do and confining her to the Monolith. Painting the number as a warning was all she could do. Maelle was able to write a full on message because A. she's implied to have far more potential power as a painter than her parents and more importantly, B. Renoir has already successfully wiped out Lumiere's inhabitants by that point because Aline was no longer there to stop him. The Monolith basically served no purpose anymore so what did he care if Maelle wanted to grafitti the thing and write "fuck you, dad!" on it? He also didn't think she could stop him at this point.

Best part is that those demigods didnt knew how to pain, Renoir says that they had to "teach themselves to use those gifts". But to not make some kind of fail safe system or something that would pull you out, its fucking Sword art online but 100 times worse. Or their real world is so abstract that they dont give a shit.

Why didnt she communicated this clearly the second our party reached her, what was the point of even fighting "us"