Final Fantasy XVII

8 characters

Have multiple story arc in game

Story involve the characters (including NPCs) interacting and commenting about each others

Each character will have their own character arc

Yeah, we are going back to the form

Write the plot and the characters to make it memorable like the ones of FF golden age

Make another road trip game but put the entire story in the actual game this time (no DLCs or multimedia content).

Seriously speaking, what can Square do to make FF relevant again?

I don't think bringing back turn-based combat alone will magically make Final Fantasy the industry's golden standard again, but they definitively need to bring back the old job system, or at least a traditional party system where every party member is essential (even if it's just the old tank/heal/damage trinity). Presentation and cinematic moments alone won't make the next Final Fantasy a memorable experience (because now we have a whole subgenre of games designed to deliver just that).

just make another XII, another XV, or another XVI with more layers of customization, better direction, and more varied side content or whatever would address issues people had with those games
they need to go back to iterating on their fucking designs rather than making a completely different game for the seventh mainline title in a row

I wish they'd stop making them look like gooks.

The pacing the narrative unfolded at was a good reason why the most beloved games acquired that status. The highly cinematic moments were based but they only capitalized on the climactic points about a story the player already cares about. If you don't give a fuck about what's going on, no amount of spectacle is going to touch you.
Thinking back on any of the good FF games and how the game are structured, it's kind of formulaic but it's a formula that works. Slowly meeting the characters (that join your party over the course of the game) across the first third of the game where you're fight low stakes battles before things escalate to world saving endeavors, and the pacing at which plot threads and character backstories developed made the games smooth and engaging to play because of the well balanced spread and pacing of content.

they need to go back to iterating on their fucking designs rather than making a completely different game for the seventh mainline title in a row

yeah that's what they used to do for the first 10 games before they decided to scrap it and spend the next literal 25 years trying to reinvent yourself over and over instead of doing what you're great at doing and what you're known for
strange, huh
can't think of any other companies that rose from literal nobodies to industry standard by iterating on doing the same thing over and over

This. DQIX multiplayer system where you can drop in and out of your friends' worlds.

Bring back party members, party management, more melodic ost.
Being cinematic is something they can't break away from, it's part of the core identity of FF since 7, but bring some new writers with fresh ideas and vision.
Don't lean too hard into open world or linearity, just a healthy mix of both as they used to do, have the world slowly open up.

another XV, or another XVI

Fucking NO. I am sick to deth of having one playable character and shitty action gameplay. I want a TEAM. I want to build and play as more than one character. Jesus Christ.

fpbp

Pander to Japan again. Whatever they do they should not try to copy E33 or try to please the western market. Bring back what people liked about the series, bring back ATB, focus on characters and their interactions over the grander plot, no open world shit, no fetch quest filler, make it semi linear with a world that progressively opens up. What people liked about the old FF games is the sense of adventure and wonder you got out of them, all the places you would visit, all the people you would meet, the things you would discover. They never had the best gameplay, the most depth, the best story, the best writing but they were damn good at leaving you satisfied and making you feel like you just went on a grand adventure.

but that would require SE to be intelligent, not retarded

Exactly. SoP had the right spirit but felt more like a spin-off experiment than a true return to form. There's something timeless about the original FF structure — a world tied together by elemental chaos, scattered civilizations each with their own aesthetic and philosophy, and a party of customizable adventurers shaping their own destinies. You blend ancient ruins, magic kingdoms, dystopian tech empires, and sky-piercing towers powered by forgotten gods, and suddenly the world feels huge again.

Keep the mythos vague and let the world breathe. FF always thrived when it gave space to mystery — not everything needs a lore dump. Just soak in the vibes, let the player connect the dots between cultures and civilizations, and let them discover something new around every corner. That’s the Final Fantasy I miss.

A pirate or mafia game

pirate

How did that work out for Yakuza? kek

FF always thrived when it gave space to mystery — not everything needs a lore dump

This is a big one and doesn't even just apply to the lore. The old games there's been so many times I'd replay them and would find some new things every time, be it some random cutscene with specific requirements, hidden items, quests. You name it. It all adds to that sense of discovery as you say, that's really gone downhill over time.

Don't know nor care, I'm talking about how SE made Port Royale look beautiful as fuck in KH3, a game based on that world would be kino

That would sell like shit. And they already did that on DS, like 5 fucking times if we count the 3DS too.

If they follow the trend of FF games XVII will be an MMO
But idk if SE will ever want to make another MMO. Seems like a dying genre

Party is:
A white warrior dude with a dead mom
A hag summoner with giant tits
A loli ninja
An old monk who is some type of anthro thing but like a cool one not a gay fetish one
Twin hebes, one is a black mage one is a white mage

make a mix of ff7 rebirth and remake

add a whole new story, new world, characters etc

adjust the battle system to make it a little bit more turnbased

have an actual story with beginning and end

some twists, some hidden areas, fun minigames add in some super bosses

no shitty ass annoying characters like mai

And the best would be by taking notes from ff12, with having various places that start small but you can revisit and it becomes more complex.
Isn‘t this literally bravely default? Go play that game. Or heroes of light.

As opposed to?

can't think of any other companies that rose from literal nobodies to industry standard by iterating on doing the same thing over and over

Fromsoft

That'd be a two billion dollar game with a production time of 15 years.

merge with the clair obscur-verse, make a game in collaboration with them that takes place in a canvas

Pander to Japan again.

every time they've done this they've made a game about girly dressup that's market poison to everyone but the most invested otaku who would've already bought it anyway

MMOs are still popular in Asia, especially when they are mobile games (PC port optional). I can see them putting XIV in maintenance mode (since apparently people are getting bored of it) and releasing a mobile-style "not-so-massively optionally-multiplayer online" game on both PC and mobile (with the mandatory gear/cosmetic/fantasia gachapon).

A fighting game with a heavy focus on a primarily story driven
(co op optional)beat em up campaign set in Ivalice.

Different jobs and equipment give access to different special moves, you choose and customize the race of the main character you want to play but you can also train side characters that live in your base with different races have access to different jobs with sub jobs and stat growths.

Online play has two modes, one with unchanging presets (Bangaa/Gladiator rushdown grappler,Viera/Red Mage a balanced rapier wielder, Nu Mou/Black Mage as a projectile based zoner, etc.) and one with a character you've built in your campaign where it can grow stronger from fighting with people online (maybe exclusive rewards for winning online).

It would be similar in the style of gran blue versus.

What a shitty idea

Pander to Japan again

Define "Japan." The Japan I know is a fallen market that cares about four things: Pokemon, Monster Hunter, Dragon Quest and gacha... As long as they can play them on 240p screens.

They are actually working on a mobile version of XIV.

The Game of Thrones approach clearly didn't work for 16 so they should pivot to watching and aping the MCU. Surely that one can't fail. Do it Squeenix, kill yourselves and do it sooner rather than later.

atb

you lost me there, kys

Final fantasy is dead

If you don't like the franchise then stay out of it

Game of Thrones

That was such a retarded idea, Yoshi was a moron for that one since at the time nobody cared about GoT

They're done making traditional rpgs anyway, might as well get weird with it.

If that's the case why would you focus on such a shitty concept?
Monster Hunter FF with jobs from the games and enemies from the games would do way better

this is just final fantasy 11 online bro

1. FF explorers was kind of that and no one cared.

2. There's already a monster hunter, it's called monster hunter.

What type of FF do you guys like the best anyways? I don't mind Modern FF but I really miss the era of FFVII and FFVIII. Felt like FFVII Remake was way too fucking silly

That was such a retarded idea

And yet the game is at its best when it apes it the most, when it attempts to shift back into "FF" midway is when it falls apart. That's the issue, lack of commitment to a vision. Pick something and stick with it.

I think the PS1 era was the best

Final Fantasy XI unironically, it is also contender for one of the best games ever made. Yes. Big claim. But once you play it you understand, there is nothing else BUT Vana'diel.

The ones with a job system.

What type of FF do you guys like the best anyways?

Make Stranger of Paradise 2 and you can have my money. Your move Square Enix.

I didn't even realize this but the weapon types in MH basically serve the same functions as jobs too.

They already did this. Its called FF1.

dude, just like make good stuff

Excellent feedback, man.

I cant really add anything to the plot or characters because i dont think theres a right or wrong choice. What i can say is that they should avoid some easy noob traps like 1. dont make the characters be one note or have the game be just be one type of atmosphere. Life has light and darkness, therefore it should be reflected. Have humor and have serious scenes. As Nomura says, as long as the story and cutscenes have intent, it will resonate with players.

As for the combat, They have two real ways to surprise everyone and be good: either a new direction for turn based games THAT STAYS TURN BASED, or keep iterating on the ARPG formula but add RPG mechanics.
In regard of the first point, they should completely avoid the "real time aspects" trap nu-jrpg fans have been loving for some reason. Exp33, metaphor, like a dragon are NOT turn based jrpgs with those QTEs and action shit, SE should definitely avoid that. Instead, take inspiration from other turn based games. A good inspiration is divinity original sin 2, ive always that game has a great iteration of the turn based formula by adding AP (multiple actions in one turn), a grid system, adding direction to combat and interacting with the field. FF should go that way and show everyone how to make real turn based rpgs and not be fake ass pretenders.
As for ARPG, its not secret that FF7 remake and rebirth have the best combat system in the franchise so i wouldnt mind something like that, but i feel theres other directions to be explored as well, as much as i love stagger system in that game it doesnt have to be that again. Keep it party based, but add another type of mechanics and growth system. FFXVI sadly wasnt the right choice but it doesnt mean they should drop it, a FFXVI overhaul adding RPG mechanics could definitely work and thats another direction they could go for.

meh. it's a fun unapologetic game but they could do better

stop having mainlines take the better part of a decade to come out, it's that easy

quality needs to go back up
getting xv tier games every 3 years isn't going to change anyone's mind

I love Uematsu but he can't handle a full OST anymore.

For the general graphics, i dont think FF has ever had problems with this. FFXVI is the best looking FF, and i wouldnt mind something like amano or old FF but "animated".
However, the game needs to have AAA presentation, not falcom/atlus tier animations and cutscenes. It needs voice acting, body language, camera work, etc, not the atlus cutscene like two people talking and barely moving or at most, n64 tier movement. Those who say "lol we dont need that shit", bullshit. Its the very first thing people complain specially with FF, remember FFXVI first trailer? yeah, i remember.
Nothing i can add with music, FF is unbeatable on that to this day and im sure they will do well regardless.
As for general gameplay, be an RPG. Dont fall for elden ring / exp33 meme """exploration""", but dont make it a checklist. Unironically, rebirth was doing well but it focused too much on towers, still it didnt reach Witcher 3 "?" map hunting tier of crap. But i liked the general content of the game.

That goes without saying, but I've grown weary of these dev cycles when we had the quality and quantity at some point.
Reminder post 7th gen graphics and their consequences have been a disaster for video games.

you start as sad ex-military combatant, in magic-techno city. there would be scene on riding train, some nigger-friend, that shoot guns, and you need to fight robot scorpion

that would be great beginning for ff 17 im sure

Getting FF games back to back that were only a year or two apart is unthinkable now but that is where the franchise was at its most relevant.

I fucking hate this line of reasoning. While I like Bravely Default 1, that was a deeply flawed game. Second and 2 unfortunately sucked ass. A huge part of these games is the presentation and while BD1 was quite charming with it's popup aesthetic on a portable console, it sucked absolute dick as a HD game.

They'd just have to give the game a proper budget and not let it look and feel like shit. There is a shit load of JRPG on a smaller scale these days (Crystal Project / Chained Echoes etc.), but seeing one with actual production values has become really fucking rare. I think that's also why Expedition 33 exploded like it did. It maybe didn't actually have the largest budget, but made the game feel like it had a larger scope.

Bringing back elemental attributes for one thing, I still can't believe they fucked up magic like that in 16.

MUH BUDGER MUH PRODUCTION VALUES

Is a sad state of existence. Sit in the cuckchair for he AAA to save you.

I think if SE really wanted to stretch the brand and make a lot of money, the most lucrative FF17 game they could make would be an mmo life sim set in eorzea.

what can Square do to make FF relevant again?

Full Tifa porn game.

I think 7R's battle system should be the one they go forward for at least foreseeable future. It's that good.

Really?
What am I missing about this?

PS1 FF works but I'm also interested in seeing what XII could have been if Matsuno didn't have a meltdown during development. Give it a job system and we're chilling. I really liked FFT but I'm not sure if it's what I'd want for a mainline.
I can accept it but stagger has to die already.

Screw you, XVI and VIIRs are good, and IX was overrated trash that also seriously needs a remake to fix it’s many issues, especially Garnet’s stupidity and selfishness and the crappy love story with her and Zidane.
fanfiction.net/s/14012757/1/Everything-Wrong-with-Final-Fantasy-IX

Seriously speaking, what can Square do to make FF relevant again?

Make it Turn Based.
Make an explorable overworld.

Is it gonna be online again

I can accept it but stagger has to die already.

Stagger is the reason the combat is so good.
But stagger shouldnt be used again just so we dont get a samey combat again.
Just keep the phylosophy of "party based ARPG" and it will be fine. Not just "use one and the others are independent", but use everybody at the same time.

man i dont think ill ever understand the love for ff7r gameplay.

What is there to not understand?
Combat is strategic. The enemy design actually HAS design. You use multiple party members each with different gimmicks, playstyles and customization. It doesnt play like souls slop. It isnt juggle slop either. Its not even KH either.

Stop trying to be a action rpg and give me a real party with interesting characters (not all male twinks).

atb

Unironically kill yourself.

just feels mashy and bullet spongey to me. i only really like playing as barret and cloud anyways and it's just pretty much stagger with or without elements -> unga bunga donga
synergy skills are mostly meh.
enemy designs consist of armor guy, annoying flyey guy that was a pain in ff71, non armor guy. then its just fill 3 bars then switch to other character fill 3 bars and then use your ult and then try to time it so you can unga bunga donga once their stagger is up and you have 3 AP bars. just feels way too chaotic

They should let Sakaguchi produce another FF.
Fantasian, even on a mobile game budget, was already better than any Final Fantasy of the last two decades.

It's a sandbox MMO

and idk not a big fan of the quickmenu. you always have to go to the menu to change it. much rather have something dynamic where you can set a list of skills in the quick menu and then use left/right to go down the list so instead of like 4 options you have 20 (5 options for each of the 4 options) so you don't always have to go to the menu to change things around. also i hate the way skills work in weapon selections. that means i have to grind the skills before i change the weapon and you get things so frequently, you can just ignore it but then if you ever wanna try that character it's like 6 different weapons to level up. also some characters feel ass to play: cough cough Aerith/Cait Sith.

Just ripoff DOS2/BG3 at this point.
FF got its start by aping off of Wizardry and Ultima, may as well bring it full circle.
People want character-driven stories with tons of expression, both in terms of plot choices and also in terms of gameplay. Square's biggest fuck-up is not making more games that utilize the job system, because BG3 blatantly exposed that even normies love cross-classing and build autism.

What power is this that compels me to my knees.

Make the series turnbased again

Abandon EVERYTHING that was done after FF12, write it all off as a massive lapse of judgement

Put emphasis on player customization and a large world to get lost in with a lot of interactive characters to meet, really stretch the "job" system to its absolute limits and expand on it as much as possible

Focus on STYLE over FIDELITY, the obsession with "graphics" is what lead to this mess to begin with

Stop babying players, most of the people who gives even a single fuck about the series anymore are over the age of 24, start treating them like the adults they are with more mature themes and more complicated game design

Stop trying to turn everything in the series into "multimedia experiences"

Lastly, go back to the series roots, really figure out what FF actually means to people other than chocobos, spiky hair, belts and convoluted dialogue

The era between FF6-FF10 will never be conquered, replicated, copied or recovered within SE ever again.
There was just something about Square Soft, it's company structure, the leadership of the 'Gooch, the entire period of time that encapsulates the 90s and early 00s with this feeling of optimisim, of hope, of unlimited potential in the humanity spirit and creativity which Square Soft was at the forefront of.
Now? Put simply, Square Enix is not Square Soft. It's time for us old heads to move on and realise the FF brand is over.

XVII is going to be the next MMO, set in a futuristic setting that looks like XIII's, lalafell are back and sexier than ever

No, I like Ivalice

Pander to Japan again.

That is literally what they did with FF13 and FF15, Japans market has been lost to gacha and nostalgia so anything you do to try to appeal to them will end up making your product worse not better. Capcom has proven that pandering to literally any other demographic creates better products and actually pays the fucking bills.

E33 is more of a Japanese game than XV or XVI are. It literally panders to Japan (except for the French DA and no Japanese voices). It's actually what FF should have: a nice linear story, party members you can control, great music, absolute cinema, an overworld.

Give FFXVII to Yoko Taro. No suit oversight, let him go full retard.

Capcom has proven that pandering to literally any other demographic creates better products and actually pays the fucking bills.

Then why didn't it work for XVI?