The idea that you need to min-max or exploit in order to "keep up" with the leveling system by "efficiently...

when the games came out, especially morrowind, it was considered to be both normal and common for players to make multiple playthroughs of games starting from scratch since people had a LOT more spare time 20 years ago, each time doing a little better and thus the games were designed around that Idea.
combine this with the pre-mass internet "everyone looks up/follows the Meta" factor and their gameplay decisions of the levelling system make a LOT of more sense.

you are not meant to do well/make lots of progress on your first few playthroughs of the game, with each subsequent runs through the game, you learn more/do better until you reach the point where you can easilly do everything in the game if you wanted.

but these days, if a games level up/progession system is anymore complicated than "you can eventually get/do everything" the average player will instantly look up a guide telling them exactly what to do on their first playthrough instead of figuring it all out themselves and then complain about it

Morrowind

>>>>both of these games

Huh??? Only Oblivion had this problem.

also case in point, since the oblivion remaster came out, I have been playing it, but since its been like probably 19 years since I played it, I made a fuckton of mistakes, such as completing quests at the wrong time and locking myself out of good gear for my build because it was levelled because I mistakenly misremembered there being more good mage/magic build gear than there actually is.
so what did I do even though I was level 27 and well deep into the game? I chose to start over from the very beginning with the knowledge to avoid doing those specific quests/going for those items until I hit lategame.

but for most people these days, the Idea of starting over that deep into the game is an abysmal thought, since these days they are used to playing through/experiencing a game once and then not touching it again

people had a LOT more spare time 20 years ago

Why? They still had the 40 hour workweek then just like today.

Question: are you finding that you level up too fast in the remaster because they made minor skills contribute to level ups?

Morrowind does not have level scaling.

Oblivion isn't hard. It was never hard, even when I was a kid. It's just tedious.
Fights are extremely tedious and boring if you don't min max since enemies get retarded amounts of health.
There's no mechanical challenge to overcome in Oblivion, it just takes so long you will get impatient and slip up since it feels like you're hitting mobs with a plastic toy sword.

cast weakness to magic and shock spell

cast shock spell

instakill 99% of enemies

difficulty in basic every elder scrolls is a meme if you play mage (which you should be doing)

because back then, it was harder for people to get into contact with you if they wanted to spend your spare time.
- mobiles were less common if you didn't have a home phone line or ignored it ringing your work/job couldn't easily contact you to cover extra shifts/work hours
- it was harder for friends/family to get into contact with you to organise things like hanging out, meaning you could dedicate entire afternoons to playing the game without interruptions
- people in general, were less stressed about time, meaning they didn't view having to start over as "a waste of precious time"

people had a LOT more spare time 20 years ago

This is the most zoomer brainrot shit I've ever seen. Holy hell I hope this is trolling.

Yeah man they had so much more free time. BRB I have a Teams meeting for my remote job, then I need to bring in my grocery, pharmacy, and lunch delivery. Thankfully I set up auto-pay for all my bills so I don't have to worry about that. As I was saying, 20 years ago they just had so much less to do.

a little, but it is a double edged sword.
because on one hand, if your playing pure Mage, once you get your combat magic skills up you can then level up blade/blunt/armour skills for a while to boost your level a bit if you need more points to put into intelligence/wisdom and it makes starting over feel better as a result.
but on the other hand, it means enemies get harder to kill quicker if you do spend the time to level your minor skills which can lead to a feedback loop of tougher enemies making your minor skills level up faster, which leads to even tougher enemies

You can always just not sleep if you feel you aren’t ready for the tougher enemies yet.

what a great solution, game of the year

If you really still want the role play aspect of sleeping in a videogame for whatever reason, just press T instead of E next to the bed.

another great solution, game of the year

I mean, you’re right, Oblivion was the game of the year for 2006.

I find min-maxing really fun, albeit only after at least one blind playthrough. Maximizing efficiency is like figuring out a puzzle. You can call me an autist if you want but we're talking about RPGs which, as a genre, are autist central.

Or Or OR!! Hear me out, you could play good RPGs like Gothic 2 and Risen

premade character

not an rpg

don't play a good rpg, play jank instead

I'll pass.

oblivion objectively makes you weaker as you level because of the ubiquitousness of enemy scaling and the low impact of attributes compared to the power gains of enemies
morrowind doesn't, barely anything pertaining to the story is scaled and those scaled things don't get utterly bloated with stats
skyrim doesn't, perks are ridiculously strong and enemy ranks keep their weak mooks
if you don't level efficiently in oblivion you are actively eating shit and can only claw it back with exploits

Just wait for the Gothic remake. God it will be so fucking bad, Jesus I played the demo and it was slop to the max

Level scaling is just bad in a game like TES, it makes leveling up feel like nothing really changed, except that your old gear sucks now, or if you level up badly, you just made game harder. But not having level scaling is just as bad, that works for structured somewhat linear games, but Todd’s games pride themselves on being fully open, you can go do shit in any order you like. Having the map divided into level 1-5 region, level 6-10 region, 11-15, and 16-20 regions would massively hurt the game, since you would be forced to either do stuff in Todd’s chosen order, or else cheese your way through content you arnt supposed to do yet, then become mind numbingly overpowered for everywhere else.

I think best solution would be no level scaling, but minimise statistical increases with leveling, so doing a level 15 dungeon at level 4 is harder than doing level 4 content, but not insurmountably harder. Same in reverse, doing a level 7 cave at level 25 would be easy, but not “one shot every enemy and be impossible to die” easy.

There’s no purpose having endgame weapons do 10x the damage of early game weapons, except to force entire game to level up and re-gear constantly. If endgame weapons do 2x early game, that’s still a huge difference, but not game ruining if you do stuff out of order, even 1.5x is plenty.

And ideally tie less and less to overall player level, and instead rely on individual skills. EG enemies later on in Fighters Guild quest should have a lot of hp, since it’s expected you gained a bunch of combat skills by reaching that point. Entirely winnable without it, but clearly in over your head.

Making game hilariously easy if you never go to bed and level up is just awful and ruins the feeling of an RPG once you figure out that’s how it works.

Bethesda is equally as jank but without the world or quest design. Or unlimited inventory. Or decent combat.

I kinda like it, it means you can't just mindlessly level up and trivialize everything, you gotta put some thought into it and level up right.

I don't really care if everything gets stronger, it's pretty easy to trivialize the game on any difficulty if you know what you're doing, I just don't want to see bandits running around in Glass and Daedric armor. That's some immersion breaking shit.

just macro thirty rank ups governed by those three particular attributes if you want perfect stats that if you don't want to get btfoed by xivilai and liches without abusing chameleon/weakness to magic/telekinesis atronach and raping the game balance

nostalgiafags are this allergic to fun huh

its shrimple though: they jumped some dremora niggas in oblivion
why they still ask you for your coinpurse? well its fun of course

just macro thirty rank ups governed by those three particular attributes if you want perfect stats

That's not in remaster, thankfully.

Every single bandit in all of Cyrodiil jumped some dremora niggas? Industrious.

yes, thankfully
the retards bitching about levelling too fast clearly haven't seen that you need 1200 skill ups to get to level 35 to get your attributes maxed if you choose to go +4 +4 +1 luck instead of +5 +5 +2 personality for the last 10 levels

was every npc always such an asshole

I didn't really have fun with TES games until I began actively engaging with the skill system and RPG side of things instead of just 'playing the game'. If you just 'play the game' it's a walking sim with shitty combat and you run around doing repetitive quests

I don't like that you can max your stats, playing a character that is good at everything is anti-RPG.
There should be a cap or something.

Keep up with levelling

Morrowind's enemy levels are mostly static

It does, but it's not as noticeable

tell me you haven't played morrowind without telling me you haven't played morrowind

you can get over all of the "difficulty" with a full set of constant effects tailor made for an ACTUAL build, you people just equip le daedric and think thats all you need for the whole game, so the difficulty of the game is your own dumbass fault for not engaging with the games spell-making and enchanting, or alchemy systems. BE CREATIVE.

be creative as he makes the same weakness to magic spell and 100% chameleon equipment

still better than crying online about "efficient leveling" or some other bs when you aren't engaging with the games systems, chameleon is a little cheesy but the game is a western power fantasy its not supposed to be difficult you're supposed to become a god at the endgame thats just one of the options.

i was expecting you to say you don't use it but wow, you actually defended chameleon stacking

you can do reflects, an absorb health resto mage, alchemy stacking, illusion with max followers build, there are a ton of ways to break oblivion my guy.

you better call up todd and make sure he removes chameleon in the next elder scrolls since it makes you so butthurt

reflect spell and damage was obvious bullshit that deserves a cut for doing double duty as resist magic and shield
absorb health was never wrong due to it being expensive as shit
follower stacking is a complete meme that paralyses your quest progress

and it was lmao
chameleon was never used legitimately as means of augmenting your sneak, you always made a 100% magnitude spell to do whatever you want at which point it became busted invisibility

needing to minmax

in Morrowind

Are you a redditor?

Morrowind doesn't have level scaling. That's it.

morrowind does have dynamic enemy levels but they are tiered and the range is predetermined for area (like one place has a level range between 1-5 and another between 10-20)
it also spawns stronger creatures instead of the same creature with a higher level

lets just remove all the ways you are allowed to use magic and limit its creative uses

you are a tasteless neanderthal don't ever talk to me again.

road and outside enemies are scaled but those are irrelevant to 99% of quests

yeah big guy, you're so creative for doing something 99% of players that gave the system more than a cursory glance did

try that in skyrim

bro wants to remove the creative freedom that makes magic in the old elder scrolls so good, the fact that you could supplement it in any of the big 3 combat triangle or even become a non-combatant just goes to show the level of depth the systems had, and im so glad that they remained intact you are an idiot for wanting to streamline something that should be EXPANDED giving players the freedom to craft magic and do all kinds of cool things to add to your build or a followers power is very cool and the later elder scrolls game systematically removed more and more of the schools of magics depths and i hate that.

goes to show the level of depth the systems had

it goes to show the level of exploitability the systems had
a tight developer vision where the systems actually just click together due to rigorous playtesting is much more superior than just balance it urself based on how much u care system that they ended up having
it's on the level of pokefags that have to play nuzlockes and other restrictive shit just to feel anything
it's not creativity when skills get eclipsed so hard they're turned into larp skills like in morrowind
medium armor? fucking awful, glass is everywhere
security? open
sneak? invisibility, chameleon, telekinesis
speechcraft? fortify personality, charm
spear? blunt? axe? short blade? hand to hand? all completely btfo in versatility and power by long blade

god I FUCKING HATE HAVING OPTIONS

i think rpgs arent for you kiddo

he didn't enchant a spear or other preferred weapon class with a broken enchant

why do you refuse to play the game, you can do all the same enchants you do on long blade on any of the other weapon classes my man, and pokemons depth with ev's iv's and deep movesets allows a really complex meta game to arise i can't see how you think otherwise.

But not having level scaling is just as bad

Enderal would like to have a chat with you.

ESL

options implies they're anywhere near equal in power
they're not
being a mage rogue is vastly better than being a rogue rogue

because as you know well yourself, in any reasonable playthrough you'll get carried by bound weapon and by the time you have the means to enchant shit you'll be invincible because the game was rushed to shit and not properly playtested

and pokemons depth with ev's iv's and deep movesets allows a really complex meta game to arise i can't see how you think otherwise.

how illiterate and stupid do you have to think i could possibly mean the faggot pvp tumor and not the ingame

a tight developer vision where the systems actually just click together due to rigorous playtesting is much more superior than just balance it urself based on how much u care system that they ended up having

it's on the level of pokefags that have to play nuzlockes and other restrictive shit just to feel anything

On the one side - yes. On the other - if you DON'T care about enjoying the game other than getting what is forced on you, you'd better play either "i wanna be the boshi" or CoD/Gears of War/whatever other movie cover shooter would suit your particular skill.

well
there's an invasion going on and shiet

You can play a mage, a mage with a sword or a slightly edgier mage!

you can get grand soul gems and a golden saint kill at level 1 on morrowind, then go get the daedric spear from the mine quest in vivek and you can enchant it by selling stuff to the mudcrab merchant to get enough gold to get your enchant i have done it many times, OR you can just get the spear of bitter mercy one of the best weapons in the game that will carry you through any fight.

and now do it without meta knowledge
see the problem? a cursory surf of the fucking wiki completely busts the game open

oh so know you have a problem with having knowledge because i proved you wrong about spears or other weapon classes being bad compared to long blade, want to do blunt weapons next, get the skull crusher at level 1

you dont have to be a mage at all
wtf are you talking about

at what point have you proven me wrong? do you think the only daedric weapons that spawn at level 1 are spears? the daedric daikatana absolutely shits all over the spear
the point is that the games never offer you a unified challenge and even at max difficulty the only limiter is your respect for the game and willingness to rp

it makes both games completly unplayable without mods.

the only limiter is your respect for the game and willingness to rp

like any western power fantasy worth its salt should, elder scrolls 6 should ramp up the fatasy to 11 and allow even greater control over the systems to the player, more is always better when it comes to build variety and gearing options, and just for the record the vivek mine quest gives you a choice of daedric weapon for any weapon class so you know.

like any western power fantasy worth its salt should

lol
imagine playing games to be jerked off by pixels

not everything has to be or even should be from soft clones because we both know thats where this conversation was inevitably headed "but in elden ring"

what does 3d touhou have to do with this conversation?

I could play Oblivion just fine when I was 11, this website is full of retarded geriatrics

you were saying "imagine playing games to be jerked off by pixels" which to me implied you wanted a more difficult and grounded experience because of the "difficulty" of from software games, because its too common these days to compare everything to elden ring as if every game needs to emulate them as the golden standard and their isn't any place for an rpg that allows the player the freedom to break it completely and i just think you are wrong about that if you think that games should be dumbed down.

The leveling system in Oblivion is awful, but the game is so normie piss easy it doesn't matter.

Same here, I whacked the minotaurs just fine when I was 12 in 2007.

whining about balance in a single player rpg

midwit mistakes 101

Nigger i was a god in my first playthrough of morriwind

Skyrim mage is so fuvking ez holy shit.
Just dual wield destruction magick and constantly stagger your opponent.

If that's a midwit opinion then you're a fucking halfwit. Balance is absolutely important in a single player RPG. Using a weak weapon isn't fun. Discovering that though no fault of your own your build is dogshit isn't fun. Your friend bragging that he's cruising through the game because he read a guide that rivers of blood+moonveil plays itself while you're struggling with your Guts larp is bullshit.

you want a fun skyrim build thats broken as fuck that no one really talks about, get the necromage perk in the restoration tree as a vampire it stacks onto you buffing you massively breaks the game fully fun as hell if you haven't tried it.

Is it just me or is the oblivion remastered difficulty turned way down?

You don't have to minmax at all. That's just a crutch for shitty players. Sorry you got fiiltered!

Did you not get very far in Skyrim or play only modded/easy? Destruction magic fucking sucks in Skyrim. It doesn't scale like weapons do. Late game you're fucking tickling the dragons with master spells.

No, adept is adept. You're probably finding it easier because remastered gives you perfect stats and fixes the absolutely ragingly horseshit endurance scaling of the OG.

lmao

I barely played as vamp. I thought overall not that useful. Sounds 8nteresting though. I recently reinstalled but got bored after an hour. Just bought oblivion and im 12 hours in. I have nostalgia for both but never felt like skyrim had as much replayability. Might have to give it another go.

Bro i stayed staggering dragons. Ez.

All i know is i dont remember the enemies dying so easy. Swear everything has less hp. Lile my memory of oblivion is that everything had too much hp if anything.

Also i had to turn difficulty to very hard. Nothing could touch me as mage.

Using a weak weapon isn't fun.

Lol.

Discovering that though no fault of your own your build is dogshit isn't fun.

Change it. Game allows for that.

Your friend bragging that he's cruising through the game because he read a guide that rivers of blood+moonveil plays itself while you're struggling with your Guts larp is bullshit.

Why do you even care about your friend turning the game into a boring cookie clicker for himself? Why do you even want such a horrible fate for yourself? Why do you even care about your friend bragging about something when we are talking about SINGLE-player game?
Go play some Dota/CS/whatever ladder multiplayer game there is and don't torture yourself with the singleplayer. You just don't want to play it.

I always figured people who complained set the difficulty slider all the way up and had absolutely shit level-up bonuses.

People in most first world countries work longer hours than before. Its partly why mindless slop entertainment is so popular

the obsession with min maxing is a cancer to gaming in general

Fucking truth.

Especially spending hours on some extra 2 points of health or something. "Efficient" "optimal" my ass

Skyrim lives rent free in this zoomer's head lol

enemies get overleveled

slide the difficulty slider to the left

Wow so hard

Hes probably mellinial or gen x. Imagine growing up on a series that rewards exploration with cool loot. Then skyrim comes out and every weapon you ever find is useless and generic because they want you to craft in order to have a useful weapon. Only thing worth finding in the game is those OP af masks.

more midwit noises

it's really not important, you can have dogshit builds and overpowered builds as long as the game is FUN. fun is the most important thing.

cast weakness to magic and shock spell

cast shock spell

enemy is daedra

it reflects the spell back into you

die

thank fuck nords can resist 50% of shock I guess but getting to 100% is such a pain in the ass and if you don't also have 100% resist magicka the weaknesses you cast are going to absolutely fucking ream you
god morrowind magic is jank lmao

Morrowind doesn't have level scaling. That's it.

if you say so kitten

level scaling was done so well people have been playing for a decadecdidnt know it had any level scaling.

It was dine differently. Higher level opponents appear in certain high level areas instead of making everything a meat shield.

it's definitely a better way to do it, the only issue being the highest level creature shows up at 14-16ish being golden saints
I've barely even started levelled up some stats at that point, not that it matters but I'm not sure why bethesda scaled level 20 as the end game considering getting to level 30 is pretty easy. Although tribunal/bloodmoon scaling is fucked.

should always have the atronach sign for the magic absord, and supplement the last needed 50% with an enchant on a piece of your gear so thats no longer an issue, weakness also stacks so you can spam it on the daedra and gigafuck him.

you can't absorb spells reflected back at you

Literal 12 year old played these games with zero issue, but the internet wants you to believe Oblivion is literally impossible because the leveling is broken or whatever. Get real and actually play the games as intended and you will have fun.

You literally watch your spells go from killing a goblin or deer in one hit to not even tickling enemies. The fact that deer fucking level scale is ridiculous. Fuck outta here.

Instead up turning difficulty to the max im about to stop leveling strength.
Pretty sure they tweaked the level scaling and difficulty for the remaster. I do find lock picking harder than i remember but i keep a lot of lock picks problem solved.

The simple fact is that no, both games can be played and enjoyed by playing them as intended

maybe in baby difficuly still doesn't get rid of the fact that the level scaling is atrocious and the game is easier without leveling at all

WORKS JUST AS INTENDED THIS IS ACTUALLY GOOD DESIGN

Poor design

Even as a teen I knew Oblivion’s leveling sucked ass when my sword started feeling like a foam bat when I was level 20.

Genuinely what is the appeal of these games? I've tried on and off for years to get into them but I wind up playing for a few days, do some story and side quests, level some skills and get bored. I'm not sure if I'm doing something wrong but I never see what everyone else does playing Todd Slop.

I build a character :)

Morrowind is boring. Too much reading.

Oblivion Remaster has made me want to play Skyrim again

preach
i always say if youre feeling a little weak all of a sudden, in either game, make a new spell or a weapon or something. just try something different. the games give you so many ways to get strong that dont involve counting skill ups like a spergy accountant

You literally watch your spells go from killing a goblin or deer in one hit to not even tickling enemies.

Huh that looks weird… I’ll just… slide the difficulty down a bit.

THIS GAME IS TOO HARD WAAAH

turn the difficultly down then

NOOOOOO I REFUSE AND THAT MAKES IT BAD GAME DESIGN

games not for you, go play skyrim kiddo

the only issue being the highest level creature shows up at 14-16ish being golden saints

ascended sleepers at 23-25 actually

Very based post

Meanwhile in actual Skyrim

Oh no my stealth archery isn't doing that much damage. I guess I'll have to switch to stealth one handed which is far superior.

There is no skill at play in oblivion so your post makes no sense

backstabs giant with one hit

Become a werewolf and spam the overpowered charge attacks.
They didn't playtest it. You can oneshot a giant like this.

yea maybe you shouldnt be using the same starter fireball spell on lvl20 enemies retard

Werewolf in skyrim was so fucking gay compared to morrowind werewolf.

not sure who or what you're talking about. i hate the level scaling in oblivion but not because it made the game harder, rather it made the game too easy. anytime i wanted an armor upgrade i'd go fight the weak bandits outside of the imperial city ready to drop the best gear in the game. it was ridiculously stupid and took the adventure=reward aspect out of the game. in morrowind you actually had to find your upgrades.

The only time i had trouble in oblivion was level 2 shivering isles, the base difficulty for the dlc seems much higher because pretty much every SI creature has poison or magic to add all sorts of nasty effects

There's no point in doing it in Morrowind but you're full of shit with Oblivion. Enemies become huge sponges if you keep leveling and you don't keep up without cheese.

Yes. It's not my job to correct for bad design.

I have like 1000 hours in Skyrim across all platforms and I have never once played a stealth archer

isnt good at the game

needs to turn down difficulty

deisgn flaw

???? Literally too easy on adept rn on remastered. I literally cannot be killed. Are you playing original or remastered.

I should not have to touch difficulty options because of fucked up, poorly designed systems.

Youre right, original was a pain after a few dozen levels (if you didnt level strength enough) and remastered is too easy. Why cant they seem to balance it even after all these years?

playing oblivion for the first time, should I get rid of vampire powers? Avoiding the light is ruining the atmosphere of the game and I feel like enemies are becoming huge damage sponges and so the vamp powers arent worth it.

For difficulty, nexusmods.com/oblivionremastered/mods/624
For Vampires, do you like stealth? No? No vampire. Yes? Vampire.

Just took on that curse for knights of the nine and keep falling flat on my face lol

Only faggots believe this

this. even though everything scales in some games can still get that power fantasy since i get access to a lot more skills and unique gear that lets me customize my character in a way that makes him overpowered

If you think level scaling isn't a game-breaking issue in Oblivion you either
A) played the console version which has universally lower difficulty
B) never played the game long enough and got high enough level for it to matter
In either case you are a turbo casual and your opinion goes directly into the trash.
I've never seen anyone mention or criticize the level scaling in Morrowind, it's a non-issue in that game and I think you only included it to try and bolster your argument by making anti-scalingfags look more irrational than they are.

Didnt you have to feed every few minutes in skyrim just to remain a werewolf? Only a faggot would prefer that.

Stealth is for fags, either tackle your problems head-on (apply directly to the forehead) or don't play at all.

Shitty bandaid solution you shouldn’t need to do.

I like the idea of stealth but even getting a 3x sneak attack on enemies barely does any damage and with the dark brotherhood armor and chamelon ring I can barely sneak around enemies

just stay stage 1
it's free stats for no real cost

1. Don't run, walk. Sprint is not running. You need to walk slowly for stealth.
2. Get the listed mod, turn difficulty in the menu back down to adept and and have fun.

thinking about playing a stealth mage. i know you can do it in skyrim but what about morrowind and oblivion?

1. Don't run, walk. Sprint is not running. You need to walk slowly for stealth.

wrong
use feather spells to cancel out your armour weight and go to a place with a static npc like one of those smaller inns and autowalk inside one of those rooms until sneak 100
sneak absolutely doesn't deserve the grace of natural levelling when they didn't have the sense to make sneak attacks give you sneak xp

Powergaming is fun and I am tired of pretending it's not.

The level scaling in Oblivion and Morrowind is very different, and it's not a difficulty issue, it's a matter of immersion.
When you hit a certain level in Oblivion lower level types of enemies just stop spawning in Cyrodiil wholesale, and all the bandits start wearing high tier armors like Daedric etc because they suddenly got powerful enough to be able to kill daedra I guess? It's a fucking mess and everybody who wasn't a retarded consolefag downloaded a mod to fix it even on vanilla's release.
In Morrowind some of the NPC's and creature's levels vary depending on your level but the game doesn't just delete them when you hit a high level like Oblivion does, because Morrowind actually does level scaling right unlike vanilla Oblivion.

Does Morrowind need mods or is it fine vanilla?

Some guy asked me why I would ever choose and orc and roll magic and I realized that 90% of people who play these games are minmaxing no fun faggots who would be better served slaving away at world of warcraft raids all day.

get the gog version. it works out of the box

Minmaxing used to be cool because you mostly had to figure shit out for yourself, or you'd see someone else talking about an awesome build they thought up that worked really well and you'd get inspired to have your own take on another build. The modern gamer doesn't even think, they just automatically google "best build" and are on a minmax path from the start without even knowing how the game works.

Just play openmw

Almost every enemy in Oblivion has a level cap, very few enemies actually suffer much from hp bloat or other leveling issues, only the ones that are supposed to be real threats in game.
So leveling up will almost always help you against enemies.

Except the most common one, bandits.

They're not even dangerous to begin with, only the captain/leader is going to have special/enchanted gear, high level armor means nothing when they can't hit very hard or proficient in the armor.

except that weaker enemies get replaced with strong ones
lvl 1 character fights stunted scamps, lvl 30 character fights xivilai

Optimizing yout build to maximize attack power, speed and buffs like heal on attacks is badass, but using ugly or dumb looking armor or weapons, metagaming quests instead of roleplaying and not getting immersed into the game to minmax and make up for your personal skill is lame.

this

No one ever said this about Morrowind, so you can take your strawman and shove it up your ass. Level scaling is cancer in all its forms.

The former is obviously what I meant. Losers are the ones going to fucking youtube without playing the game first and trying to minmax, ruining plot, quest, etc, like you said. That's not what powergaming is about, that's just a retard practically using a strategyguide and letting the game play for him.

A few QoL and visual mods are nice. I like the one that tells you how many points you've earned towards attributes for your next level up. There's one for better looking head models. One that makes right clicking close menus, etc.

Did they fix weakness to poison being fucking dogshit on weapons in the remaster or will it actually effect poisons used on the first hit now

YOu dont need to do it in morrowind at all
you DO need to do it in oblivion and this is why its a shit game

Yeah, in Morrowind enemies are static and don't scale to your level, so if you fuck up your leveling process, that just means you need to be a few levels higher compared to the enemy.
In Oblivion, the vast majority of enemies do scale to your level, meaning if you fuck up levelling, you will be super underpowered compared to everything permanently. This is why a few people even play the game without ever sleeping, though you lose a lot of content like that.

never play on the blowhard difficulties that just add more health to enemies triple the damage to (You), the player

always play on the normal, intended, (balanced) difficulty

never have to worry about imbalance, frustrating scaling bullshit, min/maxing nonsense, etc, because I have always realized that developers these days are incompetent retards who couldn't escort an elderly woman across the street without it turning into a 20 car pile up and a fatality involving bifurcation of an 87 year old

Literal 12 year old played these games with zero issue

check posts from 2006

leveling problems

Actual reason is because games are just too easy now. People are desperate for things to optimize if the base game doesn't engage them at all

I don't understand how you retards still argue over retarded issues that are only in Vanilla and where fixed by mods literal decades ago. It's like 90% of you retards don't know how to mod and never played modded TES.

those discussions are being had precisely because vanillafags insist on thinking they're superior for following "da devewopew's vision" like in the op

I just summoned shit and beat shit with my sword and magic game was pretty easy

This most fun I had in Oblivion was using enb with all that other shit to make the game look realistic, then Oscurros Oblivion Overhaul, then a mod to make it so I gained exp and good choose what to level up. Literally one of the best gaming experiences I ever had in my life playing Oblivion like that.

The fact that deer fucking level scale is ridiculous

This is why the discourse around Oblivion's level scaling is so awful. People can spout obviously incorrect statements like this and not get called out. There's just too much disinformation, and absolutely no one seems to know what they're talking about.

I recommend a mod for magicka regen if you plan to play a mage.

just play atronach and recharge yourself with a short duration ancestor ghost
the magicka scaling for atronach altmer is absolutely ridiculous

Literal 12 year olds did not 100% Oblivion and got bored long before the level scaling could shit on their garbage builds. by level 20 any build that isn't exploiting becomes pure suffering when every enemy is several minutes of slashing and spamming to kill

The modern gamer doesn't even think, they just automatically google "best build"

That's because the systems are opaque. Go into the character creator in Pillars of Eternity and it's like, "What the fuck do I do here?" And you've got contradictory nonsense like magic power relying on the strength attribute.

Now, you could figure things out through trial and error, but how long is that going to take? Usually a character has to reach high level to mature and show its worth. Are you going to play ten hours on each of your experimental builds? Restarting the game and watching the long cutscenes and playing through the tutorial areas again?

I was a kid playing this after morrowind, even I could point out the major flaws in the game like their fast travel system being lazy. I'll never understand the fixation today that kids are retarded and braindead consumers. If anything, it's the parents that buy them games that are the problem.

I only level up in Oblivion when it feels appropriate for my character to go to bed and I only use my major skills. I also don't try to do everything with a single character. So much fun. Glad I'm not a min-maxing retard.

Are you going to play ten hours on each of your experimental builds? Restarting the game and watching the long cutscenes and playing through the tutorial areas again?

Autistic self-minmaxers do this, yes, that was my point.

Honestly? I just power attack enemies and they seem to die. Idk if this is how it was in the original, but I'm not even min maxing. The only enemy that can outdps me against me is a Xivilai and I have to use ranged tactics against them. Otherwise the only times I'm in danger are if I am outnumbered, in which case I summon a Daedroth of my own to even the odds.

Playing on adept, occasionally go on expert if I'm in the mood.

TES games are not about difficulty, none of them, never have been, never will be, the difficulty slider only affects how much damage you and the enemies take, the combat is fucking garbage, the fun comes from trying silly stuff and experimenting, Oblivion's leveling system just sucks the fun out of the game, you enter a dungeon and you know you have to hit random ass enemies for 10m for them to die, its boring and unfun, morrowind is fun since no level scaling allows you to feel stronger the more you level, thats it

Playing on adept,

This is the correct way to play. People put it on Master not knowing how the game works and complain when it takes 100+ hits to kill something. Is that difficulty system shit? Yes but it is what it is; keep it on Adept and just have fun.

Morrowind is a little too easy. I'm playing OpenMW, which I think is faithful to the original in terms of difficulty and progression, and I've been dealing effortlessly with everything in the Balmora and Caldera regions. Wearing a mix of light and medium armour, and equipped with a spear, I've been able to kill vampires and wipe out the Cammona Tong at the Council Club, while being about level 3-4. There is always something you can do to cheese the fights.

morrowind is fun

That awful gameplay

lol

The fun part of Morrowind is getting a job, getting promotions, and finding an enclosed place with a bed that you make your virtual home, where you read books and become learned in the ways of Morrowind lore.

Should I buy Skyrim or Oblivion? I don't have a gaming PC so I can't mod the shit out of Skyrim. I want good role playing and good combat.

I want good role playing and good combat.

Dont buy a TES game.

its too easy, but combat isn't the morrowinds main thing, exploration, atmosphere dialogue characters and story are its strong points, if you dash in and out their range while avoiding their attacks you could say you have mastered the combat, sometimes things get complicated when there are mages or if they swarm you in areas where enemies are tougher, daedra can fuck you up in your level range for example.

used to think it was awful but if you have more than 1 functional brain cell and commit to whatever you decided to chose as your major attributes and skills the game is decent, if you commit to long blade you almost never miss, but again morrowind isn't fun because of its gameplay, its the world and story/dialogue

Literal 12 year old played these games with zero issue

12 year old me hated the leveling system in Oblivion, it felt like I had to choose between playing the game or making sure my leveling was optimal

It's all fun and games until the nefarious level scaling minotaur shows up.

but you can easily handle it by using the game's intended systems

Ok

uses the systems so my character is strong enough to win

NO NOT LIKE THAT

What causes this?

Thank god I have experienced both oblivion and world of warcraft years before the social media brainrot
Both was the greatest open world adventures in my experience

no you can't use winning strategies you have to intentionally gimp yourself

Cuck mentality.

It's due to people not actually understanding the games systems, Oblivion has one stat (endurance) that slow fighter characters need to pay attention to due to the HP increase on level-up. All other deficiencies can be offset by enchanted gear which becomes very common mid-game and can be farmed from oblivion gates.

How's melee in morrowind? My first ever playthrough was me chugging potions and dropping custom nukes all over the place before getting bored.

None of that fixes the awful gameplay. Morrowind's RPG elements are simply ass.

min max

morrowind

This is how I know you didn't play it. Morrowind requires no min maxing as long as you aren't being stupid. Like using a weapon you don't have stats for. Actual retards here

Yeah once you get past level 20 getting a full set of of daedric armor is trivial. Compared to morrowind where it's complicated even if you know how.

both games can be played and enjoyed

False.

combat so bad the only way to escape it is a style of play systematically designed to circumvent the combat

always funny.

enchant sword

100 to life and fatigue for 1 second

weakness to shock for 1 second

shock 20 for 1 second

soul trap for 1 second

kills everything in a hit or 2 and keeps your weapon charged forever

i love how morrowind and oblivion were literally designed with blowing them apart, not only in game, but lorewise too. you're literally achieving chim by breaking the games to your will... except the games are made to let you do this, so you're actually still part of the dream

Skyrim. Only zoomers "need" 100+ mods to play a game.